HTMX 2.0.0-alpha1 has been released | Hacker News Reader

HTMX 2.0.0-alpha1 has been released

v2-0v2-0.htmx.org

47 pointsvyrotek16 comments

I'm a bit disappointed at the removal of SSE from core HTMX, mostly as I see SSE as being much more in-line with standard hypertext, and there does need to be some kind of server-push-long-polling-thingy.

Not very disappointed, but I do wonder why it doesn't ship with SSE as standard.

IIRC it was considered scope creep.

yeah, it was a hard decision pulling sse and web socket support out, but we've done that already in the 1.x line: the hx-ws and hx-sse attributes are deprecated in favor of extensions:

https://htmx.org/docs/#websockets-and-sse

our feeling was that, to do those things right would require a fair bit of code and it wasn't fair to all htmx users to make them pay that freight, as these were more advanced features that many people would not be using

another feature we didn't include was idiomorph-based swapping out of the box:

https://htmx.org/docs/#morphing

that was really hard to not include because it's a neat algorithm that i came up w/ and it's going to be included in the next version of Rails, but, again didn't feel it was fair to make everyone pay for it

FWIW, since it is so easy to include extensions, I think you made the right choice. That said, for the project I want to try HTMX out on, I will definitely be trying out idiomorph swapping. Sounds novel and useful.

That's interesting, I assumed htmx already did morph the dom this way. The company I work for has a similar but custom system in place they built 10 years ago that morphs the dom for those reasons (came up in a meeting last week, it was made before I joined). Shame it wasn't open sourced back then, it's pretty neat solution with websocket signalling to do multi user screen updates.

I've been following HTMX for quite a while but never noticed the haiku in the footer before. It feels like it accurately reflects the spirit of HTMX. It is making me think I should add haikus to my projects' README.md.

  javascript fatigue:
  longing for a hypertext
  already in hand

hey folks didn't expect this to make HN, this is a very early alpha:

- the docs are not complete

- the extensions website is not up (https://extensions.htmx.org, lmao)

- we haven't done any field testing yet (this is us field testing)

that said, if you are using htmx and are willing to test out the alpha version and report issues, we would appreciate it

our hope is that most htmx users will be able to upgrade w/o any major changes

I'd be very interested in a comparison of htmx 2 vs Unpoly, since some of the issues Unpoly mentions seem in direct response to htmx, such as response code handling.

i didn't really look much at unpoly (which I admire), htmx is focused on generalizing hypermedia controls rather than competing w/ other libraries on features

I did try to make more things configurable, for example the response code handling is now declarative rather than requiring you to hook into an event & you can turn off attribute inheritance if you don't like that

conceptually the library didn't change at all

And I still don’t get all the hype and marketing around it.

Unpoly is so much better in every way you look at it.

Most people seem to be using it just because “it’s popular” which ironically is the reason most people use React as well.

Unpoly is 50kb, htmx is 15kb.

Both are small enough for this to not matter.

Unpoly also has many more features you’d have to add code for.

You see more features as better, I see them as unnecessary bloat. HTMX targets users that want easy and minimalist ajax.

You see unnecessary bloat, I see wheel reinventions. Unpoly gives me almost everything I need for any non trivial app. Same thinking about using Django/Rails/Laravel vs bare bone routers like express, Sinatra or flask.

Once you get past the simple landing page or hello world app all those things you call “bloat” come in super handy. Otherwise you end up with a custom undocumented untested unproven probably insecure rushed out implementation of what the “bloated” solution gives you. Same applies for Unpoly vs htmx. Unless you’re building just a hello world landing page, as I said.

Can you give one example of a feature that is fundamental for web development that is enabled by unpoly and not htmx?

unpoly is a great project and is absolutely best-in-class for progressive enhancement

htmx is lower level but has a bit more mechanical sympathy w/normal HTML: more work for some things, but less magic too. it's focused on generalizing hypermedia controls, as outlined here:

https://hypermedia.systems/extending-html-as-hypermedia/

there is a terrible simplicity to htmx that I think many developers find attractive after a decade of heaping complexity on top of web development

my ability to market htmx has surprised me as well, i have been silly on twitter for a long time now, but for whatever reason it recently started working

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