Atlas Air Boeing 747-8 from Miami International Airport Catches Fire Mid Air | Hacker News Reader

Atlas Air Boeing 747-8 from Miami International Airport Catches Fire Mid Air

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39 pointshaunter23 comments

I was curious how common fires are on flights. Searching NTSB data for the keyword "fire" on part 121 flights (ie regular scheduled air carrier flights, this excludes general aviation, private jets etc)

  Year | # accidents
  -------------------
  2023 | 6
  2022 | 0
  2021 | 4
  2020 | 3
  2019 | 5
  2018 | 3

So rare but not super rare.

[1] https://www.ntsb.gov/Pages/ResultsV2.aspx?queryId=262a5b32-9...

> 2023 | 6

Why the sudden spike and this year only just got started?

I think 6 is within average just 2022 has no incidents?

You didn't list data from this year. 2023 is last year. We're just getting started in 2024.

Much less common than when smoking was allowed on aircraft, thankfully. This article [1] about Air Canada flight 797, back in 1983, gives a good impression of how fires in aircraft bathrooms were much more common back then, which led to pilots treating fires much more casually.

[1]

Yeah, the procedures regarding fire were also bad. 'Swissair Flight 111' changes a lot.

This looks like (and was confirmed as) a compressor stall[0].

Not to understate the severity, but this is really something that just happens sometimes and isn't "that" bad - air stalls somewhere in the compressor, leaking unspent fuel through the back of the engine that combusts from the heat of the exhaust gas. The aircraft isn't actually on fire.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compressor_stall

... so does that mean the engine is just less efficient, or has it essentially become a paperweight, and is worse than useless for the purposes of keeping a giant metal bird in the sky? (yes I realise these planes are designed to be able to land with one engine out, or two if you're Tom Hanks and near a freezing cold river)

Believe a 747 can fly with 3/4 engines out.

There isn't a single reason for a compressor stall, so neither there is a single possible outcome. The pilots are generally instructed to reduce power level until the surging stops; if the damage is too great that won't help and the engine must be shut down. All passenger aircraft are certified to be fully controllable with an engine out, but having it happen is usually treated as an emergency. (With some notable exceptions like flight BA 268, look it up.)

This plane is a 74, so it's got 4 engines and IIRC there was at one point a trans-atlantic flight from SFO or LA (with passengers, this one was cargo) that had a compressor stall on takeoff and they just KEPT GOING on 3 engines and made it almost all the way to Heathrow before diverting due to the less efficient fuel use.

EDIT: sorry didn't notice sibling comment mentioning this exact incident, here are some links for the lazy

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_268

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWBGbi8dfac

> This plane is a 74,

Yep that's my bad. I somehow read `747-8` as `787`, thanks for the link though that was an interesting read.

> giant metal bird in the sky

FYI airplanes don't "fly" in the way birds do. You could think of it as a falling maple seed, but with two blades so it's symmetrical/balances out.

Do you have a link to confirmation that it was a compressor stall?

It's not exactly harmless either. The shockwaves can damage the engine.

https://avherald.com/h?article=513dd4e9&opt=0

According to that site, an Airbus had a cargo fire today and two days ago another Airbus had an engine fire. Also two days ago an Airbus had a brake failure.

Big oofff.

Even if harmless as other commenters say, the visuals on this make for bad PR and the timing couldn't be worse

edit: ATC in now on yt:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEwC8GVDbKA

big oof because human nature and lack of education / clickbait.

I hope it was Kelsey of 74gear fame flying, he flies 747s for Atlas Air and has a very approachable aviation youtube channel. I'm sure this will make a fantastic video if he's at the helm.

In case you haven't noticed, Kelsey almost never records anything while he's on the job. Kelsey's videos are produced from the comfort of his hotel room, nine times out of ten, and augmented by found video from social media sources.

Kelsey and other pilots generally want to protect themselves, coworkers, and employers from liability, and they also have to, you know, fly planes, so recording videos is not something they will be doing while on-duty.

Blancolirio gives interesting informed speculation:

https://youtu.be/PFCfSMgq3to?feature=shared

https://youtu.be/eEwC8GVDbKA?si=Dogsu39-LiJjQDA1

All Boeing wanted to catch was a break.

Caught fire instead.

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