In many categories, even when explicitly searching for brand and model names, you’ll get dozens of off-brand substitutions and even random unrelated products appearing above it in the search results.
Occasionally I’ve even noticed products that are available for sale (if you click on a direct link or have them saved in your favorites etc), but refuse to show up in search results no matter what!
Often it’s easier to find things on Amazon using Google search than using Amazon’s search.
If it wasn't a super shitty user experience, it would be genius!
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/11/style/amazon-trademark-co...
> A seller in America might start with a brand idea and need to figure out how to get it manufactured; a seller connected to a factory in China’s manufacturing capital needs to figure out how to sell to Americans, which Amazon has been working hard to facilitate.
> “If a Chinese factory is able to give a better price than a seller in America, Amazon is happy with that,” said Kian Golzari, who works with marketplace sellers and corporate clients to source products from China.
If amazon sells a push broom for $10, why would would someone buy a push-broom from the local hardware store for $20?
Local hardware store struggles, eventually goes out of business...now everyone has no choice except to buy online, and guess who dominates that?
And now you're reliant on Amazon for everything.
Same thing Walmart did to endless communities across America. Dump stuff cheap in an area to starve all the local businesses to death, and then everyone had no choice but to buy everything from, and work at, walmart. And if anyone gets uppity about unions, close the store and now everyone within an hour has to drive even further to get anything...so everyone is terrified of any sort of workplace organization.
As a single eccentric mid 30s guy in a small city, I get by without it. Its still annoying for me. This is the Microsoft-esque bundling strategy where several things you need are bundled in with a bunch you don't. It covers enough of the average demand to be nearly essential and products subsidize each other keeping the cost low.
I doubt it would pass the test of consumer-harm. However, it clearly stifles innovation as it is impossible to compete in any bundled category when your competitor is a megalith offering service nearly free or at cost.
This is why the poster above feels bullied. They know you need to subscribe. I personally quit prime years ago but I don't expect enough people to be able to do this to matter. For many people, even with the price bullying, bad ux and anti-consumer shit, the value is still there even if the original ROI has shrunk.
I got rid of Prime last November and the thing that I noticed with my shopping is that the blue checkmark made a lot of garbage palatable that I can now simply skip over. I always could skip over it, but now I have no incentive to give it a chance at all. I don't even need to give Amazon the chance, actually. Specifically with clothes, I was fooling myself into thinking I would find good items with a blue checkmark. All the quality brands have taken their ball and gone home to their own website, now only chaff remains.
The extra week on every purchase is a little grating, but honestly, maybe spending money online SHOULD have some friction. the blue checkmark is brainrot. It's tricking you into importing garbage instead of being more selective. It's inviting you to impulse purchase instead of pausing and considering if this is worth it. free thyself.
This seems like an exaggeration. You don't need to pay for Prime in order to shop on Amazon. You can even get free shipping without it. I can't think of any reason I'd want it. The only time I've ever had Prime was when Amazon somehow dark-patterned me into accidentally clicking it. I don't think not having Prime makes you eccentric, nor is eccentricity a prerequisite for living your life without a totally optional shopping service.
If I squint I can sort of understand sponsored products on actual product-detail pages or on the homepage, but in search on a shopping site it feels really user-hostile — you’re searching because you’re looking for something specific, not browsing.
This is what we don’t seem to accept. Enshittification.
Also shipping and return policy is so convenient, that even the grumbling people are eating this up.
They may be suggesting on sellers request unsold or rarely sold products that vaguely relate to searches, but sellers want to get rid of quickly.
Hey boss I made the site better! Through rigorous A/B testing I could figure out a way to tweak our search algorithm so people spend much more time on our site! It seems they now really enjoy browsing for products!
Ok but seriously, I have witnessed A/B testing go wrong in the past so I'm biased to blame everything on it. I wouldn't think this particular thing happened though. :)
What I could imagine is that they measure number of items bought or money spent, but even then if eg you don't also track how much of these people return stuff later you still might draw the wrong conclusions. Figuring out that a user is less likely to use your site six months down the line due to building frustration is even harder.
Also known as unethical, non-consensual human experimentation for profit maximization purposes.
Nazi Germany and the Tuskegee Experiment are examples of “unethical, non-consensual human experimentation”. A/B testing features of software usually doesn’t make the same list.
If you're from a certain background it's exactly as described. In academia, frankly probably everywhere but tech, experiments as a term of art require consent when they involve humans.
* n.b. you really should have left it out, it was a good post through "hyperbole", got close-minded in the next sentence, then just sort of blew the hatch doors off. Sometimes we just don't know something someone else knows. Not understanding someone else doesn't require they have a psychological condition, much less one worth noting.
N.b. "godwin's Law" is the famous joke that as an Internet discussion approaches infinity length, hitler will be brought up
Not a secret message saying discussion over lol
Unless you’re a hermit you are an unwitting participant in nonconsensual human experiments on a daily basis.
Fascinating. How were you able to draw a distinction in your previous comment, then? :)
> When I worked in my university’s statistical consulting center in graduate school I could have consulted on the same experiment either subject to IRB or not depending on who the client was.
(emphasis added). Somehow you misread it.
I did have a similar job for 2 years (statistics assistant farmed out to help out on different grants as needed), but clearly not long enough.
I'm a bit flummoxed, though. I had the very distinct impression an IRB imposes certain requirements.
I shouldn't even call it an impression, you're aware of it too.
Like, an experiment under the IRB has certain tasks others don't.
I don't understand what I'm missing or what's missing in our communication here.
I almost called up an old prof to ask but any question I could think of, I sound high ("does an IRB supervised experiment have different requirements from, say, a city changing traffic light timings on a street?")
Are you just trying to say in theory an IRB could always impose no requirements other than talking to the IRB, and the IRB considered human subjects and say "go ahead, ethical"?
Note that's still a distinction. FWIW that doesn't happen in tech, no IRB, no reviews of experiments. Infamously this caused some issues at Facebook
Nope. Being used as an unwitting guinea pig for a trillion dollar corporation sure as hell makes me tired though. It's extremely tiresome and demoralizing, knowing that just so much as browsing their website contributes to their profits.
Basically we should have to consent for them to profit off of us in any way.
Nobody reads that stuff.
If I put two different marketing messages on two different billboards to test whether one is more effective than the other, is that unethical non-consensual experimentation? If not, how is it different from A/B testing?
Research has a lot of policies and systems set up to ensure that if your testing involves people, you must get informed consent from the persons before even trying to do the test, and it's really not hard to imagine why this is a stringent standard -- it's very easy to miss how "simple tests" can and often are adverse to those participating in the test or have unintended consequences that the researchers didn't accommodate for, regardless of the reason they did not.
Ads are often portrayed as harmless but, like, there's a reason there are restrictions on advertising for certain highly addictive products and regulations against false or misleading advertising, or certain tactics aren't allowed.
If this is based on the possibility that one or more of the ads is harmful, how is it less ethical than the time-honored alternative, which is skipping the study and just running the ads?
Why? Is it false?
I get that reaction a lot. People have directly called me unhinged. I don't really mind.
Many of my ideas I developed by discussing this stuff with people on this site. I guess not every idea is socially acceptable. That's fine. I still want to express them.
> is that unethical non-consensual experimentation?
Yes. It's really not any different than some published psychology experiment. In fact it's much larger in scale, has much uglier interests behind it, has proprietary and unpublished results. Social sciences wish they could get away with shit like this!
Only reason it's "legitimate" is everyone depends on it to make their millions. Because money excuses everything. Just like unending amounts of first party malware corporations ship to users on a daily basis. We used to recognize that stuff as the malware it is: adware, spyware. But then corporations started doing the same thing and suddenly it's "legitimate" because they put some clause in some terms nobody reads.
It's an extremely broad category that contains good things (installing cycle lanes to see if they encourage cycling), neutral things (making both flower mugs and wave mugs and seeing which sells) and bad things (use your imagination).
I lean towards "no" but I have trouble either accepting or rejecting the proposition. It's hard for me to say that A/B testing is done in bad faith, but it's also hard for me to say it's entirely unmanipulative, either.
The new "customers" at the center of Amazon's business model are a global assortment of insta-merchants that don't make the products, don't handle their own logistics and don't have recognizable brands. So -- whoosh! -- in comes Amazon as the ultimate partner/toll-collector. For a fee (or actually for many fees) it will shine up these impostors to the point that they can conduct a lot of business on the Amazon platform.
When Amazon provides distorted search results, my hunch is that it's providing boosted listings for whatever pseudo-merchants are willing to pay up. Or that have agreed to buy other Amazon services. And, hey, Amazon is going the extra mile to make them feel well-treated
*Note, they 1099 you for full retail value so really it’s just a discount of 100% minus your marginal fed and state income tax rate!
To me, seeing their review is an indication of terrible product that decided to pay off some easily corruptible reviewers that give away 5 stars just to keep receiving free stuff.
I understand your explanation, but as a user, established brands don't have to pay off reviewers at all.
For the longest time, I couldn't understand what people were talking about when they said Amazon's search interface is terrible. People would tell me they search for a specific book or author, and get totally irrelevant results. My experience was totally opposite.
I had to finally see a screenshot from someone's browser to believe it. It turns out uBlock has been blocking this content the whole time, and I never noticed it at all.
It's a very fuzzy and inclusive search, and that means that it is awful for finding specific things.
If I need a bag of insulated crimp terminals ring terminals that work on #10 screws and 12 AWG wire, then: That's what I need, what I search for, and what I want to browse.
And Amazon might show me some results that fit, but they'll be mixed in with results for extension cords, and machine screws, terminals for solar panels and car batteries, and also key rings: Stuff that has that has no merit to me today.
I just want some ring terminals, and they're more willing to show me everything else instead.
The noise is worse than actually-random results since my search terms are just sprinkled all over the place.
I just made it up as an example of something that I had failed at in the past, on the basis that this kind of technical specificity has generally lead to daunting results in the past.
Finding specific things has generally been a frustrating mess for me on Amazon.
But I did try it just now: I searched for "ring terminals 12 #10" and got a long list of stuff that is actually worth considering.
WTF?
This is good and welcome, but it was certainly unexpected.
Perhaps their search engine has improved for some of this kind of thing.
That gets a much better result.
Ive also noticed lower prices for the same items if ive recently searched on walmart or target recently too…
Following that, in order, were the following:
https://www.amazon.com/Powered-LEINSIS-Individual-Switches-A...
https://www.amazon.com/RSHTECH-Individual-Switches-Splitter-...
https://www.amazon.com/ikuai-Charging-Aluminum-Splitter-Incl...
https://www.amazon.com/TP-LINK-UH720-7-Port-Smart-Charging/d... (USB 3.0)
https://www.amazon.com/Rosonway-Charging-Aluminum-Splitter-R...
Am I missing something or do all but one of those do exactly what you want?
I too have been spoiled by parametric searching.
Nothing like going on digikey and specifying that I want to see all rs232 transceivers with maximum X ma of hysteresis, >=3 drivers, >=1 receiver that supports Y-Z operating temperature and xxx kbps.
Also gotta love rockauto where you drill down to your specific year/make/model and it lists every oil filter that's compatible segmented by quality. (But figuring out the warehouses are a total pain)
The warehouse game (or at least the version that I play) is just to optimize shipping expense.
They've got a checkbox that says something like "Choose for me" that seems to help, but it kind of sucks if im being particular about a number of parts.
It would be better if I could just check all possible candidate parts as I compile an order to complete a project, and have it pick from just my selections.
(Like, maybe I don't care which brand of coated rotors I get -- at all -- so I check all of the coated rotors.
And maybe I'm happy with either Bendix or Powerstop pads, so I check both of them.
I also need an oil filter. I understand that in my car, Mahle is fine, so is Mann, and so is one particular Purolator, while I also understand that the low-end Fram is not OK.
So I might pick the candidates that make sense for me there, too.
And then, ideally: I push the "Now save me some money" button and it optimizes the order to ship one part for each set of candidates as cheaply as possible.
It doesn't seem to do this.)
Truer words have never been spoken.
I always get an ad for something else (that isn't marked as an ad).
I live in the third world, in Amazon's estimation-- Switzerland, Ireland, the Netherlands. If I search for something, there's a better-than-not chance that it will explicitly say in the search results under the item "ships to [Switzerland]," but when I click the item, I get "sorry, this item does not ship to your location" and I can't order it. It makes searching on Amazon incredibly frustrating because I have to click through every garbage 3rd-party knockoff of the thing I'm looking for to find the one garbage 3rd-party knockoff that ships to my uninhabited, remote shithole of the European backwaters (Zurich, Amsterdam, Cork). But will Amazon offer me an option to filter out things I can't have? No, of course not. Why? Shut up and stop asking questions, that's why.
What's worse, even this is still miles better than stuff-availability in Ireland was 20 years ago when I first moved over from Chicagoland. That was a blow to my expectations, I tell you hwat. I may have single-handedly kept eBay.com in the black between 2005-2016...
Naw, that's one of eBay's strong points. Lots of ex-US business from int'l people willing to sell to others internationally. Or just breaking tariffs/barriers/price discrimination/parallel imports.
I just never understood most American seller's resistance to selling internationally, but worked out in my favour as a seller. I just charged a bit more than cost for shipping and it made up for any losses + inventory moved faster.
Walmart seems most primed to do this, barring third party sales. Or Sears, if they ever had a miraculous turnaround to their old days.
The kit won't include plumbing, HVAC, electric... so it isn't 100% what Sears did in the 1910s, but it is actually pretty close.
You can’t get a $50 WiFi 6 access point at Best Buy, but you can find that on Amazon.
I think what you are describing is Walmart or Target but with filters applied to turn off third party sellers.
As an aside, what’s interesting about Amazon is that once you unsubscribe from Prime, it’s not incredibly competitive with AliExpress for the right types of products. Usually if you can wait a week, you can wait two and save more money.
There are a whole lot of products where saving cash easily trumps having a good brand standing behind it.
Phone cases are a classic example. Some of my recent purchases like a toilet paper holder or emergency ponchos are similar. Even clothing is getting to the point where name brands are barely more dependable than Amazon off-brand clothes that probably come from the same factories.
Sometimes “untrustworthy” brands go above and beyond mass market retail options, like the LED automotive lights that AutoZone won’t sell me.
Plus, I’m in a sedan, while everyone else drives a huge SUV that rides higher than my car.
I don’t see how my light system is any more offensive than the luxury cars that have the same thing from the factory. The only difference is that I don’t blow all my money on a stupid car payment or a thousand dollar feature package just so I can see better at night.
I also installed LEDs for the license plate lights which has no negative effect on anyone, and now they won’t burn out all the time.
(I did not install turn signal, brake, or high beam LEDs, I just installed the stuff that annoyed me by burning out all the time)
I'm in .uk and have yet to have a problem (there was one sneakily labeled listing but the keyword they'd stuffed in wasn't one I understood and the price and product were both what I wanted/expected so -I- wasn't disadvantaged by that listing at least).
I can't get a hitman on amazon, so technically it's not an "everything store" to begin with. But for the purposes of this conversation it clearly is
The vast vast majority of consumers will only expect to find legal products/services on an everything store. If you are going to qualify everything to include things that will potentially land the user in prison, then sure, we shouldn't call it everything.
Even BestBuy/Target/Walmart/Home Depot/Lowes/Staples/REI/etc to an extent, if the item is sold by them. Stores with physical inventory and presence that have to worry about rates of return will probably do more due diligence than an online marketplace.
It’s just an AliExpress with a better return policy, which is worth something when I need something cheap to solve a niche problem.
But my serious purchases all happen elsewhere.
Is there a "quality filter" setting you can toggle on and off? Who decides what goes on which side of the filter? At Amazon's scale, it would have to be automated.
Much like search SEO and every other algorithm, people would start to figure out how to game it, and eventually Amazon would give up trying to police it because it would cost them more money than it's worth, and you're back to where you started except now you have an additional - and inaccurate - "quality" attribute on every product.
It's good to have such choice.
I think the difference is that before a lot of white-label product factories would cut territory-based deals with resellers, so in (for example) the US, that widget is called "Acme Widget" but in France that exact same widget is called "Le Widget Magnifique".
Around the world there might be 100+ companies selling that same product but typically not competing with each other because they would each have exclusive markets.
But now with these global marketplaces, that same approach feels weird exactly because you can suddenly see the same exact products being sold under different names, and it's a lot easier for any random business to white-label a product and reach a global audience.
Amazon is a free for all when factories can just direclty dump their garbage. There is no brand recognition or reputation. It's all just random character strings attached to random products. If a QUENTOC dog leash is prone to snap and whiplash your face, they can just dump the brand and move on.
The one time I used their ecommerce platform (due to a gift card), I got a damaged product drop-shipped as an Amazon gift.
Quality and trust are not words that I have ever associated with Walmart, even in the brick-and-mortar world where it is much harder to pull a fast one. Color me skeptical.
Guess what? Amazon acquired them and vaporized it.
Who loses?
The only way for others to compete is to have a 3rd party help them all become just as easy as Amazon. We need someone to partner with Fedex and step up. Who can do it?
I want whatever program you’re on
I live driving distance to two amazon warehouses. I can get a great number of products in the same day.
Anecodtally: I am in a super-urban location. I order Prime 2-day, on average, twice a week. It has been late maybe once in the past year; often, it comes a day early.
I see more of the new Rivian Amazon vans than any other vehicle on the road in the morning, and yet somehow, every other item I order gets unexpectedly delayed for days and days.
not that 4 day delivery is bad. but promising to deliver something, and then regularly failing, is. i'd make plans for the thing being here by the promised day and just regularly be screwed.
I live in a "suburb" of about 100k people right now, and Amazon 2 day delivery is fantastic. I still canceled my subscription to prime, though.
Once you can no longer get every cheap bauble under the sun delivered tomorrow for free, suddenly it all looks so much more like undesirable, wall-to-wall crap.
We probably order 2-10 items per week and never return anything. I bet we're the perfect customer.
We also do Target pickups once every two weeks for bulky items.
I think I'm OK with Amazon being Aliexpress for the US market. Sometimes I want to get random crap from the depths of Shenzhen, and Amazon is that. What is unfortunate is that they can't get "real" brands to sell there, because of their counterfeiting issue. The "mistake" Amazon made (that has probably made them hundreds of billions of dollars) was to let someone send in a box of crap and get paid when someone shopping for "Tide Laundry Detergent" gets their box of crap instead of Tide Laundry Detergent.
Other than that, they're where they are today because they're good. I just wouldn't buy anything valuable from them; laptops, cameras, phones, etc. Those you'll have to find a dedicated electronics retailer. But sometimes I'm like building a 3D printer and I want a touchscreen display or something for it... for $20 I can have one the same day. That is super neat. It works because no "brand" makes parts for hobbyists, and some company you've never heard of in China is actually the market leader. Amazon connects you to them... but also to billions of scammers. Caveat emptor.
Edit to add: I'm talking about the in-person stores. I have no idea what Wal-Mart and Target do online.
Are you talking in-store or online? If I go to walmart.com or target.com and search for "usb cable", I don't see a dozen cables that fit 95% of use cases like in the store. Walmart shows thousands of results, the vast majority of which are marketplace sellers selling through walmart.com. Target has "only" 753 results, 600+ of which I find are not actually sold directly by Target if I dive into the filters. Basically it feels like Walmart and Target are trying to turn their online shopping experience into amazon.com.
It exists for tools and parts and hardware: mcmaster.com
But that brings me to the type of site I want to see. Not curated luxury products like Le Creuset cookware at a markup, but curated dirt-cheap Alibaba products with low margins that have been tested and vetted extensively.
Massdrop or Monoprice are a little bit like this, but only for a few niches like headphones or cables.
When things show up and actually are what I expect based off of the image and they work right it is a rare surprise.
I think one factor might be what city you are in. I’m in Austin and I think there must be a big warehouse nearby because it’s not that unusual for something I order to show up a few hours later.
FWIW, I placed exactly 100 orders in 2023.
If you're getting commodity stuff from the cheapest vendor, good luck. There's lots of stuff put in there by Chinese shops that's garbage quality, mislabeled, a miniature model of the real thing, etc.
You might be buying off-brand stuff.
But what you'd find at Target or Microcenter, and you'll have a good time.
I’ve been more and more ordering elsewhere. I order direct from the manufacturer when I can.
So, Amazon bought my good will back again with that. They shouldn't have had to do it, though.
I could also make a more graphic analogy, but I don't think anybody needs to read that.
But when I just need some basic household thing and don’t want to become an expert on the category, I often shop from other retailers where I can just be pretty sure they aren’t selling garbage.
Any porcelain measuring spoon someone like Crate and Barrel sells is probably a decent porcelain measuring spoon, but if I buy that on Amazon, I have to worry about which brands are legit so I don’t end up getting a spoon with porcelain-look paint that will flake off or something like that.
A marketplace where almost anybody can sell almost anything has a completely different level of trust than a store where professional buyer is making a conscious decision about what products they should carry - the presence of many low quality products dilutes the entire marketplace, even the quality products from legitimate brands
(I'm still having good results from amazon but I can understand 'entirely enshittified' as an opinion from people getting a similar thing there)
I’m an enthusiastic amateur home chef. I have ordered some of these “trash” whetstones.
My knives get sharp. They aren’t damaged. The whetstone works over time.
If you are like a knife artisan, yeah I guess Amazon won’t work for you. But I’m guessing the results work for 99.9% of people.
Where I have not found that is if I am browsing, e.g. today I wanted to look for an evaporative humidifier. The top results are sponsored and for brands I have never heard of like YougetTech. I find I have to depart Amazon, Google / Reddit for things to get a sense of what the trusted brands are and then go back on Amazon to purchase it.
The phrase "caveat emptor" was coined long before Amazon existed.
We were foolish to think that situation would last.
Nowadays the search is unusable. Unless you go to an individual brand's "amazon shop", you will only get products from UUMEBE, SYLTOM and YGWEEN. And "Amazon's pick" will be either Amazon's own product or TROWLY. Perhaps on the fourth page you will get a proper brand. You get products at $1 with a shipping cost of $67. Customer service now asks many questions. When you want to return something, the site uses dark patterns to try to nudge you into getting the products to the post office yourself instead of sending you a messenger. And the prime subscription price went up.
I cancelled my prime account. If I want Chinese quality merchandise there's a Chinese store very nearby where I can go and look at the plastic at least.
You mean like the equivalent of sorting by lowest on eBay??
Like a Chinese guy I can walk up to and say, "I need a 120 foot HDMI and I will not be paying a cent over $22.43 for it because that's what's all the lowest cost sellers on eBay charge."
Maybe ignorance is bliss.
Amazon is horrific for browsing or searching — anytime I don’t know what I’m looking for, and I want to have more data to inform a buying decision. Their reviews can’t be trusted, and their search results optimize Amazon and the sellers over the buyers.
I used to rely on Amazon for confidence in purchasing a good product, but that’s not been the case for 5-10 years. I have to do my research somewhere else (often Reddit) before making a purchase.
Unfortunately there are a number of products (e.g. iPhone cases) that even that’s impossible to do nowadays. But fortunately, these are usually cheaper products, so the risk is a bit lower.
I’ll still continue shopping at Amazon, once I know what I’m looking for, due to the things I mention in the first paragraph. But I no longer trust it for discovering products and informing choices there, particularly for anything meaningful.
When I want to search I use google or Reddit (mainly google across Reddit).
When I want to purchase I use Honey.
When I want to browse (home goods) I use shopDeft.com and switch to photo only mode.
Amazon search is so bad and has so many ads that there are multiple opportunities to do something new.
(a) don't care about the quality of, because they are either frivolously cheap or you are able to to the necessary 'QA' repairs and inspection yourself (for me these are things like circuit boards and household consumables);
(b) something you already know you want that specific thing of and the shipping speed and return policy make them the best online option;
(c) are only buying because you found it somewhere else and you didn't know you wanted it until you were told about it (deal sites like slickdeals are where I encounter this);
then amazon is fine.
Are there any that you can recommend? Google seems very unreliable in that department these days, it's very hard to say which reviews are honest and which ones are basically ads. There's also the additional complication that some sites that try to be honest receive products from manufacturers, which limits what they can say to keep their manufacturer relationships going.
Also, google "best [item] reddit"
More and more I've taken to just checking what Costco sells, and if Target or Walmart (or other "big, real stores") are willing to ship and sell it themselves.
Half the time I get tricked into buying a book my Kindle doesn't support and I have to spend half an hour yelling at support to get my money back.
Because they let you do the "buy and deliver to my kindle" thing even when your kindle is not supported. Then only when you grab your kindle to sync you learn the bad news.
Is yours super older or what?
Could also be a matter of differing practices in different countries, or prime membership(I have none).
I definitely agree it's weird how different people's experiences are though.
I think part of the problem they've been having is that because they're an "everything store" they don't have a clear target audience so disappoint everyone. There are online stores I love out there, but they tend to be opinionated about the type of products they stock and how they do things, so although I have less of a selection it's more likely to be stuff I want. But that opinionated nature means a lot of people just won't shop with them because it's not what they want.
A lot of the issues I seem to hear here stem from relatively high end consumers seeing cheap products on Amazon and not liking that it's difficult to find the quality. But similarly elsewhere I read accounts from people looking for cheap products and saying that there are cheaper places to shop these days. Sometimes I wonder if Amazon was just a little more opinionated about what they stock whether that would help a bit. It would at least reduce disappointment. Although I suppose that goes against their whole ethos of having everything.
I would like a "what store is everything in" product. Search for something, and it gives you back matching products in stores 5/10/50 miles from you; purchase online, pickup from the store (or pay for an ubereats like delivery). As you build a cart, it attempts to cluster items. You get the convenience of search and online purchase, so that you don't waste time wandering around stores and not finding things, and you get the item in your hand quicker if you're prepared to go get it once purchased.
Big advantage to whoever built it: you don't need to compete with Amazon on logistics. On the other hand, you have a hell of a network effect to overcome, though if you focused on one geography only to start, it could be doable.
Such a thing, if it took off, could reinvigorate physical retail businesses. Google had a half-assed attempt for a while with local shopping, but they never really pushed it that hard...which I think was a missed opportunity.
I think the real product there would be a universal inventory system for all stores. And small stores like local hardware stores might not have comprehensive inventory, so then you get in to things like inventory scanning robots.
Point being there’s several layers of missing pieces (I believe, I know next to nothing about retail) that make the top layer hard or impossible. Google for example is probably plugging in to APIs for a few large stores like target and Walmart and skipping all the little ones.
I guess another option is a store network that is a franchise model of one company. All the products come from that company but franchise owners decide what they actually stock and carry. So they could be a hardware store or a home goods store etc but it’s all one centralized system underneath. Each store has a standard fulfillment system so you can pick up in store or get things shipped.
Alternatively it would be nice to see an Amazon style store but everything is vetted as decent quality. Problem is it’s just hard to keep up with the flow of new goods from overseas showing up on Amazon and if you’re going to vet items for quality that’s going to add overhead. I guess that’s basically what stores like Target do.
I started a personal collection where I just kept removing sponsored content or really anything that wasn’t relevant to what I was searching for or what was in my cart. I spend way less time on Amazon now. It’s not really meant for general use, and I don’t update it much, but here’s what I have if anyone wants to try it for themselves:
https://github.com/namuol/browser-qol/blob/main/blocker-rule...
Unfortunately every retailer are also starting to be a platform for other shops as well, inflating their numbers and polluting their search results.
Amazon really has terrible filters and search.
SEVERAL of the products on the first page werer knock off Legos in boxes that looked almost identical to actual Lego boxes, fonts, numbering, and all.
It’s just a scam site now that happens to also sell legitimate products.
Searching for other products results in more irrelevant products every day. Even searching for exact product names will not get you that product that you know is on there. The search seems to have been gamed into a mess.
... and because they have terms that are actively anti-competitive, like if you sell there, you can't sell the same items anywhere else online for a lower price (even if the other venue has lower associated costs).
- searching for a brand, rarely returns items by the brand
- search results are extremely poor and quickly get worse as you browse
- they hold packages for shipping by non-prime members
I haven't used Amazon regularly in several years so maybe it is more apparent for me. I also don't trust the "higher" end products to not be counterfit. It's a classic case of overoptimization, they may make more money but the experience is SO BAD. I have bought elsewhere because it was honestly kind of a chore to find what I wanted on the site.
Amazon, Walmart, Ebay, are all very imperfect businesses. Even Costco is rough to deal with for the suppliers - there’s just no way to do this at scale while being all nice and fuzzy
Amazon is especially bad though
No excuse for their behaviour, but the expectation is not high.
Think about it - Amazon gets to take a fee on - accepting inventory into warehouse, holding inventory, listing fees, listing ads, sales fee, shipping products, accepting returns, destroying returned merchandise.. and probably a few more things.
Amazon makes money whether the underlying sale of products is unprofitable .. because that's someone else's problem.
Especially when you realize that Amazon holds a gun to the head of all these "scammy/crappy" sellers and makes them pay even MORE to be the first suggested result, etc.
You can then open up your favorite Search Engine and see it as the first result, linking to Amazon.
I'm pretty skeptical that such a thing is possible.
but I guess it generates too much money for Amazon to care :(
Honestly I'm surprised that there have not been any larger scale legal consequences given that Amazone seems to be economically harmful to the domestic market (kills domestic competition but in different to the competition manages to avoid a lot more taxes) of most non-US countries and it's given them perfect munition to use PR and legal means under the guise of consumer protection against it.
Just to be clear protectionism is a dangerous tool, which only should be wielded in a generic non target specific way, like requiring online shopping platforms, even if they sometimes just act as a proxy, to fulfill a certain degree of due diligence when it comes to effectively handling fraudulent companies selling through them. That also probably could get ride of TEMU (which is more a tool of spying, economical warfar and other bad stuff then any honest competitive selling platform, they are losing too much money on each sale for that).
I mean a think which had been true before the internet was that if you can't provide a service reasonable safely you can't provide it at all (grossly oversimplified, not that people didn't try and got away with it). No reason this shouldn't apply to the internet. (Many TEMU products are not legal to be imported in the EU, often due to safety reasons, sometimes due to other reasons like being imitations of (Nazi germany time) Nazi artifices and stuff like that).
you aren't getting a contender as long as the regulations are abhorrently lax about both the workers and the sellers. along with consumer rights. there just is no economic incentive to improve but rather dig the moat.
Asking the government to create regulations for product quality just means that the lobbyists who actually write those regulations are going to fuck you over yet again.
So while in paper these 3 items look easy, they're likely not.
Some people have this notion of only buying best-in-class products or the latest stuff which they have to rigorously find by going through tons of reviews and looking at various articles and what not. I have (almost) no FOMO, and I don't mind not having the best, it frees up my time to do more important stuff like spend time with my children or watch a movie with my partner.
government is the family no matter how you personally emotionally identify it.
you actually want your electronics to interoperate.
everyone wants to not have to think about things.
really, you disagree with society and it's really impossible to look at modern society and think this happens just by random good nature and not well to poorly coordinated hierarchy.
you already benefit from existing regulations but they're so painless that you've intrinsicalyy assumed they're naturally constructed.
you live in bizzaro world claiming you don't want unleaded gasoline or clean drinking water, seat belts, crumple zones and the rest.
just wait for the digital equivalent of https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/tylenol-murders-1982
The manufacturer of a product is liable for product defects, not the distributor. The seller/distributor is usually liable for accurate descriptions, etc. Caveat - I'm not a lawyer, and this is probably dependent on a bunch of other stuff and contracts, etc.
In any case, the reality is that safety incidents drive improvements in standards and enforcement and policy changes at the governmental level. Historically - car crashes, airplane crashes, water pollution, etc, etc.
Does this mean you need to wait for bad stuff to happen? - Not necessarily, but it does mean that you gotta have a lot more backing beyond "guys, trust me, this is a problem waiting to happen". If you can get enough people to agree with you, then you have some support to propose a change to policy at the governmental level, otherwise this is just venting on an online forum.
The usual followup is "people are barely making ends meet how are they ever going to have time to hit the streets over this" - Well, every change has required sacrifice and it would be nice if this wasn't the case - but that isn't how the world has worked so far.
Until your house burn downs or it destroys your phone. Minimum enforced standards are a good thing because the vast majority of consumers are not capable of evaluating the safety and compatibility of devices.
You can't just trust the seller or people you know about a power supply (in this example) being safe.