Hacker News Reader

Comment by Arainach | Hacker News Reader

Except that an EV isn't cheap. Buying a $50-60K EV over a $30K IC does the opposite of leave budget to spend $1000 on a road trip rental.

View on HN

I use an electric cargo bike. It's a really expensive one that cost almost $7000. You can get a perfectly usable one for less than half that price. I use it for what most people use their car for in 90% of their trips, including picking up 2 kids from daycare and school. And I use it year round, including days like today when it is -11 degrees C (12F).

I don't pay fuel. I don't pay insurance. I don't have to finance a car.

When I need to move something big or heavy I rent a full size van or a box truck for about $100 for the day. Most people pay more than that just for car insurance in a month. And then I get a vehicle that is exactly what I need, including a lift gate when suitable. I rent a nice sedan when picking up my in-laws at the airport and a big station wagon when going on holidays with the family.

And I'm still ahead thousands of dollars every year compared to the average car payment which is more than $500 per month even for a used car.

What bike model do you have? And what addons are you using for the trips with kids?

Riese & Müller Packster 70 Family. The only add on is a rain cover.

I don't drive, and instead spend what sometimes seems like a fortune on Uber. But in the UK the average monthly spend on a car is ~500GBP when include the amortized cost of the car itself.

Even when my son was swimming competitively and we had to Uber him around to 6 training sessions a week plus often competitions many miles away, I only briefly averaged 400GBP/month in total transport costs (though with the caveat that I work from home; had I commuted full time it'd have added ~200/month to get in to the centre of London, but then again I'd likely have spent that even if I had a car because commuting in to the centre with a car is a nightmare)

And I got to sit and relax and read or talk to my son or listen to music and not have to pay attention to the road.

I get that some enjoy the actual act of driving and/or driving a comfy, fancy car, but for many, it's a really expensive enjoyment and I suspect a lot of people have not considered just how much they could "paper over" edge cases and issues with public transport (yes, I know this is not a viable options for huge parts of the US) or choices like yours with Uber or rentals.

You can get cheap car in UK for like 2000GBP and maintenances + insurance would be around 1000GBP per year. When I was in UK we even got a car for 450GBP and drive it for 2 years without issues.

You can, and yet your total costs including fuel will still far exceed my transport costs. As I've said elsewhere, do your numbers for your use and pick what's best for you.

> Uber him around to 6 training sessions a week plus often competitions many miles away, I only briefly averaged 400GBP/month

Uber in the UK must be awfully cheap?

Six trips a week (round trip makes 12) plus a few far-away competitions, so at least ~50 trips a month. For 400GBP?

I rarely use Lyft/Uber but even the shortest trips I've made (just a few miles) are at least $30.

The 2 mile trip to my local train station typically used to cost ~6 pounds outside of surge pricing. I's gotten more expensive, so if I had to do it again now I'm sure it'd start adding up.

Most of his trips would be to local leisure centres within about a two mile radius that would have been walkable in 20m-40m if not for the lack of time to finish up work, get him ready after school etc.. Normally I'd prefer to walk, and that's a large part of the reason my transport costs are very low.

EDIT: Just checked my most recent few trips, and I paid 16 pounds for a trip Google Maps tells me is 7.4 miles driving distance, and 20 pounds for the return the same distance. The last few trips to my local station have been between 6.50 and 8 pounds, so definitely gone up.

That's nice and all, but if I were to have done that, when I was living in a small town, I'd have been cold and wet a lot of the time. Don't see how to use the savings to fix that.

I’ve bicycled (on a normal purely human powered bicycle before I got kids) all year round in Scandinavia (and Michigan) in both small and bigger cities for decades. I’ve been neither cold or wet very often. It’s not particularly hard to dress for the weather.

I have cycled year round too, with proper waterproofs. Unless you wear some kind of helmet with a mask, which is not usual, you still get rain in your face. Cold rain. And it rains a lot of the time here.

Rain in the face has honestly never bothered me. Somewhere between -5 and -10 degrees C I replace my bicycle helmet with a ski helmet and ski goggles. Somewhere there I also start wearing a baklava.

A balaclava, I assume :-)

We recently went through our first car purchase in over 5 years. Even when you choose a cheaper EV (so worse in non-range aspects) or even compare used, the math still doesn’t work out. EV + rentals for trips costs more over a 5-10 year span even after accounting for the gas and maintenance savings. So I’m kind of confused why people are suggesting rentals for trips as an alternative. You don’t even break even.

Then dont buy a 50-60K EV? buy one thats 30K or less?

Why not buy one under 10k? How about 5k?

How about a million k.

The average new car transaction in the US is $48k.

I do suspect we'll start to see lower priced EVs in the used market in coming years however.

Or not… what's the point when spent batteries give you very little range, and replacing them costs more than the entire vehicle?

He was comparing like for like. I don't think anyone will deny that EVs are more expensive

like for what like? give an example.

Did you not read the article? A major point in the article that this thread is based on is that electric cars are 28% more expensive than ice cars.

If you're going to spend $30k you can get an excellent ice or an entry level ev.

KIA Niro: $26,840. KIA Nero EV, $39,600. Plus taxes, fees, and loan interest. If you splurge on the Niro EX trim to get a few features that you don't really need but can't decline on the EV, that brings it to $29,540 - still $10K (25%) less. https://www.kia.com/us/en/vehicles

Chevy Blazer: $35,400. Chevy Blazer EV: $56,715. https://www.chevrolet.com/

Subaru Outback: $29K. Subaru Solterra: $45K.

No one makes a direct Sedan comparison that I am aware of, but:

Tesla Model 3: From $39K. Subaru Impreza $23K.

>Subaru Solterra: $45K.

All the Subaru Solterras at the local Subaru dealer were going for north of $66,000.00 when I was down that way a few months ago.

Sincerely: Hell naw.

Is that order from factory vs drive it away pricing though?

Reply on news.ycombinator.com