How do you generate passive income?
Online? Real estate? Investing?
Scalable revenue-generating assets.
Let's work backwards on that:
Asset: We're going to call an asset as something that can generate value or appreciate in value. So your 2005 Honda Civic is not an asset, but a 1969 Corvette Stingray might be. Websites can be assets, so can intellectual property, contracts, royalties, real estate, stocks, etc. So step 1 - you need asset. Things that can go up in value, or generate value.
Revenue-generating: You can buy for appreciation, but that takes a lot more money and skill. So you want revenue-generating assets to get passive income: That means things that kick out money regularly. That would be real estate where the rents are higher than the PITI (principle, interest, taxes, and insurance) + maintenance. That could be a website that you can make money from - ad revenues, product sales, etc. It could be something you've written that you get royalties from.
Scalable: And here's the magic that puts it all together - scalable means you can build it bigger without it demanding more of your time/resources (like a job does). Real estate with positive cashflow tends to be scalable, because if the property appreciates even 10%, traditionally you can mortgage a new property. If you don't mind doing repairs/adding value, you can mortgage a new place, repair/upgrade it to get higher rents, do so, have it appreciate, use the new equity to get a new place with cashflow, etc. Some high percentage of self-made millionaires in the USA are from real estate due to this fact.
There's other ways to get scalability. Obviously a useful website, or something with automated fulfillment or marketing. But scalability is key: All the time, if you want passive income, you need to spend money out of your profits to remove time and automate more. So pay a fulfillment company $2.50 per package (on top of the postage) to mail your thingy for you. Get into automated marketing with Adwords or Adsense. Look to ink deals that'll keep paying you without you putting in more effort.
The formula's Scalable Revenue-generating Assets. That's how to build gradual increasing passive income. It's harder than it sounds (like everything worthwhile is), but completely doable if that's what your goals are. Just don't forget that active income is pretty cool if you love what you do.
Also, once you have substantial passive income, or have people believing you have substantial passive income, don't forget to write the motivational book, follow-up video/DVD, and talks etc., and milk that passive cash cow.
Infact, mass market brand awareness and brand appeal should be the ultimate aim - if achieved, seems to be an excellent form of substantial passive income these days? Seems to work for celebs, popstars, sports stars, authors, and super-brands alike?
Really, you want to read the 4 Hour Work Week. It goes through how to do this step by step.
I tested a selling a database via adwords as suggested in the book, and I got a decent enough response that I'm outsourcing the the database development in the next few weeks. It's not going to make tons of money, but it might make $300-1000 a month in passive income. That's worth the effort for me.
His sections on time management don't translate extremely well to developers, but focusing your time very narrowly on what's essential and most productive makes a lot of sense.
Yes, there's a tone of self aggrandizement throughout the book that can get annoying. But there's a lot of really helpful ideas which are worth the read.
... or worth summarizing:-)
edit: the chapter on virtual assistants was also interesting, but if I recall, he didn't write that chapter.
It is hard to have true passive income, but this is pretty close. Owner involvement is definitely key to the success of a small business, but we have a managing partner which reduces the time I spend on that business.
The great thing about passive income is that it affords me the opportunity to try and create additional revenue streams. Right now I am launching http://statzen.com. I assume that will also take several years of hard work, but it is enjoyable work.
It was much harder than it looked and at times it felt like we were going bankrupt. But now it is great.
Our program pays you for 3 levels below you in our sales matrix, so if you have 5 people per level you can be receiving profits from 125 people selling vitamins!
All Ponzi schemes are the same.
If an MLM pays commissions on product sales (either directly or through your recruits), then it's perfectly legal.
Also, my understanding is that real interests rates are currently negative. On top of it all, the combination of a nominal capital gains tax and inflation means you lose ((inflation * .15) * your net worth) every year in this manner, at least if you are a US citizen. In light of all this, perhaps you should consider spending money on your intellect; it's not taxed, and it has some degree of liquidity. Alternatively, buy a cheap foreclosed house and rent it out; that may be profitable right now.
China, Saudi Arabia, and Japan have political considerations, as well as financial, so they are more likely than an impartial investor to take unnecessary risk or allocate funds poorly.
> They don't do so well. Why would you?
Maybe because an individual only has to resolve a handful of ideas in their head, rather than thousands? Or perhaps due to the absence of competitive forces involved with ulterior motives.
Have you gotten any pushback on your $19.95 price?
Handling: $5
Shipping: $4.xx for <4, $9.xx >5+
Basically if you order over the phone it costs you $15 or so, plus the inconvenience of having to wait on the phone, and verbally submit your credit card information and shipping address.
In the end, it really costs my customers $5 for the convenience of ordering online, through PayPal. Economies of scale let me process each order for less than what it would cost to order 1 at a time, so I can cover the final shipping cost on my end because of the savings.
I haven't had any complaints about price, but I did see a comment on Jackcheng.com comparing me to GM or Ford because of the price.
edit Here's the actual comment if you don't want to go hunting for it: "That's awesome that you take a $4.95 product and mark it up to $19.99. Do you work for Ford or GM or something?"
I don't think he ordered one.
BTW, thanks for telling us about your site. I have been wanting one of those.
Then again it is December and a lot of orders might be Christmas presents. I'll have to see if it holds up afterwards.
Site / blog sponsorships. I'm not talking text link ads but actual sponsorships from key companies in my sector. It's not big money but enough for me to spend my time working on what I want rather than what I have to.
In the past, I had revenue generating webapps, but I sold those in order to build some capital for future projects, savings, etc. I should probably get on to building another to be fair..
Oh, some low-maintenance Web hosting and domain registrations too for ultra old Web design clients (when I did that sort of thing). Keeps the servers paid up for me to use for my own stuff :)
How does that work, exactly? Do you mean, you put links on your page to those other key companies and then get paid per click?
Let's say you run a .Net blog and a .Net tools vendor wants their logo on the sidebar of your blog. You say, sure, it costs $500 per month (or whatever) and that's it. If you've got the readership, fame, or whatever, it's reasonably easy. You won't get an awesome CPM but it's nice to have known companies supporting you.
Shortened version for people too lazy to watch video, Type in keywords appropriate to your site in Google etc, look at the ads in the sidebar and approach those companies directly.
I have one suggestion. I watched the "How It Works" video, which was informative, though a bit slow-paced. However, the soundtrack could really be improved. That looping Windows chime forced me to mute the video =P
Good work!
It's not something you pick up just like that. I've been making music as long as I've been programming (about 27 years). So take this "passive income" and divide it by all those hours spent. You'll get something close to zero.
There are books on the topic. I recommend "Tunesmith" by Jimmy Webb. It's about the art and the industry.
On another note, it's really hard for me to bring the two things together. I could program audio software but that's programming, hardly any "art" involved. Lately, I've been making music for computer games but that's just the art, no technical knowledge required. As long as I can think, it's been either/or.
I'm actually that "rockstar programmer". ;)
That said, tarsnap isn't profitable yet, so the fact that it can keep itself running without help from me doesn't make it a passive income stream yet. :-/
Good resources: Apple Documentation, especially the sample projects; http://ericasadun.com/ especially her cookbook; #iphonedev on freenode.net
http://www.stanford.edu/class/cs193p/cgi-bin/index.php
You should also look at these tutorials:
http://icodeblog.com/category/iphone-programming-tutorials/ http://www.webresourcesdepot.com/iphone-application-and-webs...
If you want something more general / third party, though, check out http://www.mobileorchard.com/ - it's a site I'm involved with, but we try to be objective.. (pun semi-intended ;-)) We cover higher level stuff mostly. Lists of resources, sites to check out, etc.
If you want more mac side of things then iPhone, then i can't say enough good things about Aaron Hillegass' Cocoa Programming for Mac OS X book.
I'm moving there from Cambridge, and I'll miss Ana's.
i also like the tonayense taco truck on harrison and the al pastor at san jose at 24th & mission is delicious.
if you want something a little less authentic but healthier seeming, try papalotes at 24th and valencia.
I also make desktop software, but I think that's very active - http://gearsquare.com/actiongear/
edit: oh, I see, just on webfaction
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/103-3188...
New editions of existing books is an interesting twist, though. Did you write the originals? If not, how did you end up doing the updates for later editions? (I'd be kinda ticked if my publisher didn't come to me first for a new edition of my book, for example...and it's one reason I didn't write a second book...the apress contract actually had a weird provision about not needing any permission from the original author to release new editions, and granted them the ability to do odd things to the royalty structure for subsequent editions.)
Even if you lose money writing a book (you probably will--that's why editors rarely quit to become authors), you can still impress at contractor interviews by showing up with your published book. Or use the book to raise your speaking fees, etc.
Though there are some publishers who put out crappy books that I would think would have a negative impact on your credibility. I won't name names, but two folks I know to be very smart and definitely experts in their field (I believe both are users here, though not frequent users), wrote books for Apress and Packt, respectively...and both are pretty sloppy, occasionally repetitive, and sometimes even wrong. The funny thing is that I know they're both capable of writing great documentation, because they've done it for their projects for years.
I had quite a bit of editor input throughout the process of writing my book for No Starch, and I was one of the technical readers for an O'Reilly title, so I know that a lot of effort goes into making sure books from top name publishers (and mid-tiers like No Starch) are readable and reasonably accurate.
Then again, I don't know that anyone who ever hired me because of my book actually read it. So maybe it doesn't matter if the book is sloppy. Maybe it just matters that it's available at Amazon.
I'm not really familiar with the lingo, but what is an acquisitions editor and/or where can I find one? There's several topics that I am extremely comfortable with and could see myself writing on.
What did you write and how much money (order of magnitude would do) did you make? I am thinking of taking up writing full time. Thanks in advance,
It's a book about UNIX system administration with Webmin. I made about $10k in the first year or so after it was published, and then I've made $100-$400 per quarter ever since. I haven't done the math on what those ongoing royalties added up to. I just consider it "mad money". I buy myself somethin' pretty with it whenever it comes in, like a Nintendo DS, a BMX bike, or something similarly goofy.
Oh, and I received a one-time payment of $3000 for the Japanese translation. I really take great satisfaction in that one...it also looks awesome on the shelf. The American version is cute, but the Japanese version is simply amazing.
It is obviously a niche book, and a more general topic would have probably sold more (the best I ever saw it ranked at Amazon was in the 3000s, I think). But, it had ancillary value to me, so I had already written about half of the content before I ever had a book deal for it. It was also free online from the very beginning, so my website was probably competing with book sales. I guess, to be fair, I've gotten probably tens of thousands of dollars worth of marketing value out of that content over the past 8 years or so (I was working on it in one form or another from 2000, or so, onward, and it has been responsible for a large portion of the organic web traffic my two businesses have received). The book (and the wiki that replaced it) has consistently received 30,000 monthly visitors, or more, for as long as I can remember...that's an awful lot of free ad impressions (we have links to our products in strategic locations within the wiki content, and I had banner ads for my previous business' products on every page in the old non-wiki version). It's really high quality traffic, and I'd pay over a buck a click for that kind of traffic from Google AdWords.
Actually, now that I'm thinking of it in those terms, it was probably a great investment of my time. I should probably write another one. But, I spent a lot of time writing it. I'd probably go faster today, for a number of reasons.
Also, when I moved to the valley, they went to some lengths to track me down again, so they could send me my royalty checks. I forgot to let them know I'd moved, and my old email address is one that I pretty much never check. So, I think I can say that, all around, they're good people.
Very useful Information. Thanks !
booring... I like the iphone answer better ;) Wish that was me !
PROPERTY: Real estate generates good returns principally because the numbers are large to start with so even modest returns on the investment can be very substantial in real terms. It is low risk if you are sensible and crunch some numbers beforehand (to ensure affordability).
If you buy a good house at a good price (mortgage long-term affordable for you even at low occupancy/yield rates) in a good area you will generally be able to rent it easily at a good return. If the property increases in value, that should be treated as a bonus. Get a few houses in same area and options such as hiring agents to find/manage tenants and maintenance companies to look after the properties become cost effective (though even with many houses on rent I still found it was cheap and easy to manage these myself and still work fulltime, the key is to have a list of good trusted tradesmen willing to do jobs for you when you need them and pay them well (above market rate) for doing a good job – it is cheaper in the long run and property is best played as a long-term game).
Buy near places that always have good and constant footfall and preferably long-term renters e.g. near universities (students will rent 1-2years generally) or centers of commerce (office staff typically rent ~6months but will pay more rent and have less wear-and-tear on your house). Favour long-term tenants on cheaper rents less likely to bother you (usually they will appreciate you charge them less and do most minor DIY jobs themselves, plus you will have more candidates to choose from so can be more selective).
WEB: Websites/Online is far more hit-and-miss and frankly unless you are building a mass-market and scalable product/service, ideally something people want, it does not seem worthwhile to me. For better or worse (generally better), you are already competing on a globalised playing field (with more competition, copycats, lower barriers to entry etc.) and without the captivity intrinsic to property. I am sure many aspire to become the next FaceBook or social-network-thingy but that generally seems hard work and risky (er, Pownce.com?). Focus on a disruptive technology product (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disruptive_technology) making use of new advances as they emerge, ideally combining or converging two or more disciplines, aimed towards a fixed market willing to pay seems a better bet. However, as I gear towards that, I have initially opted for the easy-wins of technically less complex but almost totally automated and revenue generating product-based sites like http://www.sportingglory.com. So far this has been working very well. Once setup, they require less than 4 hours per week combined, and provide long-term passive value without further the need for major enhancement [if they were on a the BCG Matrix, http://www.12manage.com/methods_bcgmatrix.html, they would be cash-calfs ;)]. I am now at the stage I can start having a go at the more adventurous sites/products. Hence, for websites, I would treat them as businesses initially and go for things you know you can build and create revenue from, and convert them into passive streams later in the lifecycle (but you already know that).
INVESTING: Investing (stocks, shares, bonds, savings accounts etc.) has proved to provide constant but modest returns but that is primarily because I am not a risk taker in areas I know little or nothing about and hence have always invested in safe products/funds and stayed away from the stock market. This has by far been the easiest way to make modest amounts of money (4-8% p.a.) for almost zero effort (on my part) as most products can be bought/setup/created in a few hours/days (trackers, bonds, funds) and managed by a fund manager, or minutes (savings), with little more than needing to know what the rough interest rate will be. It is a good way to park cash for a while, especially if you are lazy.
However, given that many of the people with the largest passive incomes on the planet (as well as some of the richest) belong to the world of Finance, I am sure effort spent learning about how to operate and navigate in the Finance world and invest wisely would provide the best forms of passive income I can achieve, but sadly I have no real interest in it.
TRADITIONAL BUSINESSES: Bricks-and-mortar business in conjunction with a partner, and the understanding that later on they will run the daily business while you remain in a supporting role, has provided both the best experiences and passive income I have achieved so far. This works especially well in simple businesses e.g. restaurants/bars, where once things are up and running, they basically run themselves (and they are fun to set up). Eventually even your partner will basically just oversee staff and could run several outlets. If you apply this to several businesses e.g. an estate agents, a law firm, an accounting practice, and a I.T. services company, you unsurprisingly have a series of businesses that literally grow each other, requiring little or no extra time or effort from you.
(OTHERS: I'll save it for another day/thread. Way past my bedtime and it is showing in the writing...)
So it is great to hear you like it!
But SEO consulting, that's just sick, man.
Oh and I don't mean that first house, as an investment....I mean that 2nd and 3rd you buy, hoping to make a few hundred K in a couple of years.
So for passive, you gotta go with something safe. Stuff like gov't bonds etc. Because otherwise you are pretty much guaranteed to lose a ton of money.
Really? My father has been involved in RE for over 20 yrs, has done great and is doing very well currently. There is much more to RE than just homes: Raw land, commercial properties, multi-unit housing, agriculture land (which is actually appreciating right now).
I mean that 2nd and 3rd you buy, hoping to make a few hundred K in a couple of years.
This is not investment. This is flipping. Something that has got a lot of ignorant people in a whole lot of financial shit now days.
-- With my fathers advisement, we are making great passive income with the four-plexes we own (think small apartments).
Do you honestly think you can get money passively? As in by doing nothing? Downvote me all you want, but I'm actually disappointed to see a thread like this on the home page of hacker news.
You guys should know that there is no such thing as "passive income" and anything worth doing is going to be difficult. You are wasting your time trying to find these "do nothing and make money" or "get rich quick" schemes.
Passive income is money generated without requiring you to go to work, trading a set amount of hours for steady cash. Instead, it's spending the effort on building something (whether it be a book for royalties, a website for subscription payments, investments for interest / asset worth increase, or real estate for rental money) that generates a cash flow without requiring the 40 hour work week.
Granted, it's not "passive" in that you still need to spend the time and effort to get it up and running, but once your system in place there's usually much less time involved to keep it operating, which is why this type of income is much more attractive - you can scale this system to make much more money than you ever could through salary.
However, the risk is correspondingly higher; if your product doesn't do well, you don't get money, whereas you can get away with a reasonable amount of subpar performance at larger companies without too much problem.
If so - that is passive income. OBVIOUSLY it requires capital / time / effort / luck / something to start with... But once that part is done - the rest is passive.
No one said "free" income, no one said "do nothing" income and no one said "quick" income-- they said passive. i.e. spend once (either with time or money) and keep earning.
I get a check every month from a biz I sold-- no effort for the last two years. I rent a house up in Anchorage, Alaska with a property manager-- no effort for the last 3 years. Some passive income is easier than others, but almost none of it is easy.
I had a Facebook app which was basically working well, generating thousands a month. I thought it was on autopilot. But always stuff would go wrong. An ad network would start paying less after they realize I'm not trying the competition, so I have to try to negotiate. Facebook would change their API in seemingly compatible ways, but necessitate changes if you want to stay in the game. Disk space would run out. Increasing popularity would require optimizing stuff and so on and so on.
Good old 4 Hour Work Week