The Star – Arthur C. Clarke (1967) [pdf]
sites.uni.edu
sites.uni.edu
This story was first published in 1955 and was collected in
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Other_Side_of_the_Sky
The story was reprinted in the author's own collection of his favourite work:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Nine_Billion_Names_of_God_...
https://faculty.winthrop.edu/kosterj/WRIT510/readings/The%20...
I thought, none of this is a coincidence because nothing is a coincidence.
> While Clarke's story ended with the priest in despair after the revelation that the alien civilization had perished in order to light "the Christmas star," the TV episode added an epitaph by the aliens, revealing their acceptance of their place in the universe. Brennert later commented that "Over the years I've taken a little bit of heat from certain fans in the science fiction community for changing the ending of this story. I actually maintain that the ending as it is in this episode is implicit in the story and is not really at odds with the kind of metaphysical work that Clarke did in Childhood's End."[1]
you really just need to make it though the first thirty minutes, maybe an hour or so, before you crack the game open and realize what it is you’re playing - and then it only gets better from there.
I think a better way to end it would have been for Dr. Chandler or one of the other non-believers, moved by the scale of the event, to have a change of heart about religion. Perhaps not all the way. Perhaps he comes to the protagonist on the observation deck, his face now uncertain, and with difficulty asks what made the protagonist start to believe. The protag is faced with trying to console this man plainly in need of spiritual support -- perhaps while at the same time feeling his own religious conviction slip away.
It’s a “less is more” strategy that works for many people, but of course every reader is unique and it might not work for you :)
Actually, I like my ending better :)
I guess we had to wait till Douglas Adams for such absurdities.
I also think yours would have been a good twist.
"He who built the Universe can destroy it when He chooses. It is arrogance—it is perilously near blasphemy—for us to say what He may or may not."
If you think my proposed ending creates "warm feelings" in anyone, then I didn't communicate clearly. In my ending, two people have spiritual crises, which propel them in opposite directions, and both are left unresolved.
>people who are into nonsense
I can't tell if you mean me, or religious people, or someone else.
Clark was against religion. Idea that there still should be some kind of universal religion is the opposite to this.
The Star – Arthur C. Clarke (1967) [pdf] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29680799 - Dec 2021 (44 comments)
The mechanism for non-super novas is very interesting: a white dwarf in a binary star system steals hydrogen from the other star, then heats it until it starts to fuse, which blows it all off into space!
Then, and now, I thought an interesting retelling could involve the protagonists discovering a civilization (Type II+) that had learned to tap the energy of their star and (eventually) inadvertently triggered a supernova, though that fate took some time to unfold and so various laments were left behind on their planet's surface.
Upon realization of the above, the principal protagonist (Jesuit priest) recollects about his crews' wonderment that one civilization's end could, across light years, so precisely signal monumental changes in another. Unanswered questions are raised as to Redemption and Doom. The story ends with the principal protagonist having made a 30-year Ignatian retreat and marveling that, among all the myriad unanswered questions, Earth wheat and grapes were immediately cultivable in the alien soil, such that the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass was able to be offered uninterruptedly from the day they arrived to the present.
Enjoy and happy holidays!
Christus natus est
O Χριστός γεννιέται
Христос раждается
המשיח נולד
ابن الله يولد اليوم
শুভ বৰদিন
শুভ বড়দিন
क्रिसमस की बधाई
క్రిస్మస్ శుభాకాంక్షలు
I'm guessing you wrote in the languages you know (I did).
The first, I expect requires no explanation!
The second and third are in the Bengali script, which is used primarily by Bengali and Assamese—but the letter ৰ is no longer used in Bengali.
The fourth is in the Devanagari script, which is used by many languages, but Hindi is the biggest one by far. (Second comes Marathi at about ¼ the native speakers, then Bhojpuri.)
The fifth is in the Telugu script which is primarily used by the Telugu language.
(Sources: personal knowledge of Bengali and Telugu and recognition of Devanagari, as an Australian who’s spent a lot of time in India, mostly in Telangana and West Bengal; and affirmation by Google Translate auto-detection of each one in turn, though that’s not very reliable as you’ll easily see if you try just pasting the whole lot in, and observe how it decides it’s Telugu, but still happily translates the others as “Merry Christmas”… except the Assamese, which it translates as “happy birthday”. Google Translate makes huge gaffes with Indic languages even if you identify the language correctly, and it just gets worse when it’s trying to translate it from a different language.)
Google translate added Assamese recently, that might explain the gaffes.
Google Translate has major gaffes in many of its less common languages. This is nothing particular about Assamese.
Yes, that seems to be stuck and no progress made there AFAIK. For those interested, this Twitter thread covers the timeline - https://twitter.com/KabirFiraque/status/1066392176689643525
Gleðileg jól
Glædelig jul
Fröhliche Weihnachten
—--
”God jul” is either/both Norwegian and Swedish. The two languages are mostly mutually intelligible; written Danish is as well but Swedes and Norwegians usually find Danish pronunciation… not so easy to comprehend.
With Icelandic there’s already much more guesswork and expertise required, mostly because the language has changed little since the days of Old Norse, and has not undergone grammatical simplification or adoption of (mostly Germanic, Romance) loanwords nearly to the same degree as the others.
I went to a church with my girlfriend's family the other day (by Stockholm, Sweden) and there was a 1000 year old rune stone, which was pretty much just Icelandic (https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upplands_runinskrifter_214).
Sobering words indeed
If an omnipotent God could arrange such an explosion, and we presume Him loving of all sentient creatures, He could easily arrange His explosion to avoid harming His creatures. Such a story wouldn't happen in the first place.
But what if He did? Anyone reading the Bible -- as certainly a Jesuit would have -- knows there is no theological requirement in Christianity that God value a life as humans value a life. "My ways are not your ways, says the Lord." St Paul is explicit that the notion that Pharaoh was created entirely for the demonstration of God's power by Moses does not contradict the justice of God. (Nor does he say Pharaoh was created for that purpose; he doesn't know, and treats the possibility as a hypothetical.)
Nor need the civilization's members be created simply for some demonstration. Perhaps they suffered the judgement of Sodom and Gomorrah. Perhaps the nova was the End Of The World for _that_ civilization, a component of its Second Coming, just as (Christians believe) our world will eventually experience. Genesis, Exodus, Paul, Revelations each provide precedents for such an apparent catastrophe. The priest can easily imagine any number of explanations consistent with his faith. (Indeed one might be the light of one world's closure illuminating the opening of another, reminiscent of the Greek's beacon signaling the fall of Troy in Aeschylus' "Agamemnon".)
Whether we look at the story from God's end or the priest's, it doesn't make any sense.
The reader doesn't need to _like_ any of those possibilities. The point is that the values by which we like or don't like anything are not necessarily the same as those of God. C.S. Lewis imagines a devil overseeing temptation during WW II saying "I am not in the least interested in knowing how many people in England have been killed by bombs. In what state of mind they died, I can learn from the office at this end. That they were going to die sometime, I knew already. Please keep your mind on your work." ("The Screwtape Letters".) For Lewis, death doesn't mean the same thing to God as it does to us.
Still more, the Christian thinks the perspective by which we judge doesn't know all that He does. Many very clever people have pointed out that a super-intelligence will think differently than we do. Boethius argued (in the sixth century) that God's different experience of Time can explain the apparent contradictions of omniscience and free will. That lightweight Godel argued out that what is logically contradictory for us, trapped in sequential thought, can be resolvable by an infinite knowledge that is beyond sequence. More recently (and casually) Vernor Vinge posits (in "A Fire Upon The Deep") that the study of super artificial intelligences will be classified as "theology".
And the reader doesn't even have to buy any of that. That's what tolerance is about, we're all free to form our opinions and arguments as we think best.
But it is just ignorant to, well, ignore those opinions and arguments that we don't agree with.
And it is remarkable how many supposedly intelligent, curious and tolerant people become so ignorant of what careful and intelligent people have thought when the topic is theology.
It would be different if the commenter would be trying to make an actual, intelligently argued case why the link shouldn’t be shared in this instance.
That being said, one could instead link to https://web.archive.org/web/20080718084442/http://lucis.net/..., where the story is “reprinted by permisssion”.
I've complained to HN about this and proposed solutions. They don't care.
You can say arthur clarke has passed on - but part of the way he was rewarded in his life was through licensing the copyright of his works to publishers, and copyright extends to 50 years after death, last time i checked. and diminishing publishers' ability to make money off their licensed works diminishes our ability as a society to support artists in their work.
I see support for nytimes here vs. chatgpt - isn't that the same thing as this, just on a different scale?
I don’t think there was a star in Bethelem at all, most of the Bible is metaphorical, and a story of the of a culture, society, and religion.
The Bible cannot be interpreted as a historical book, but a faith one.
It certainly can to some extent because there are enough 3rd party sources about Jesus.
> Today scholars in the field agree that a Jewish man called Jesus of Nazareth did exist in Palestine in the 1st century CE, on whose life and teachings Christianity was founded.
That’s like saying Forrest Gump is historical because Vietnam is a thing that happened, and JFK was president.
https://www.vatican.va/content/pius-xii/en/encyclicals/docum...