Comment by twodave | Hacker News Reader

Comment by twodave | Hacker News Reader

As another pointed out, from the fact sheet:

> 2. There is no practical way to eliminate all mold and mold spores in the indoor environment; the way to control indoor mold growth is to control moisture.

> 10. Molds can be found almost anywhere; they can grow on virtually any substance, providing moisture is present. There are molds that can grow on wood, paper, carpet, and foods.

But I'd also add:

11. There are many kinds of mold, some more harmful than others. Some are literally penicillin. Some just smell musty, but don't pose a threat. Some can cause severe health problems. The only way to be certain what type of mold you have is to have it tested in a lab.

12. DO NOT try to clean mold yourself. If you try to do this without knowing the proper procedures, you will spread the spores all over your house and into your air conditioning system. Generally every house has mold in it, somewhere. Exposed molds should be remediated, but don't go tearing apart your house to find mold (you'll definitely find it if your house/apartment is over a certain age).

13. Bleach doesn't kill mold. It only turns it white. Hydrogen Peroxide does kill it. You can by concentrated hydrogen peroxide from a lab supply store (we buy 35% and dilute it to 3.5% for everyday cleaning). Spray it onto surfaces in a fine mist (don't soak things) and leave it for 5 minutes. At this point it's mostly stabilized into water that you can wipe away with a paper towel or cloth.

14. Insurance companies really don't like paying for mold remediation. We recently uncovered some (Aspergillus, the Penicillin mold) below our kitchen sink and had to rip out a bunch of cabinets to get it all cleaned out. It coincided with a leak we found in our garbage disposal unit, and our insurance company (Front Line) is now attempting to intimidate us into dropping our claim by using words like fraud and sending forensic inspectors to our house.

The best advice I can give is to take pictures before you think you need to, especially when it comes to moisture-related damage and repairs. We had a plumber come fix our garbage disposal, never suspecting we'd be filing an insurance claim, so we didn't record as much as we could have or take photos of the initial issue, and that may end up costing us.

Killing the mold isn't the problem. That's the easy part. Denaturing or removing the mycotoxins is the problem. The mold doesn't make you sick, it's the mycotoxins that some molds excrete that make you sick.

Look at this study that used gamma irradiation, detergent / bleach wash, and steam cleaning to test as ways to remove mold mycotoxins on paper, cloth, wood, and carpet. Unfortunately none of these techniques worked to inactivate mycotoxins, with two exceptions. A detergent / bleach wash worked to inactivate the mycotoxins on paper and cloth, but not on carpet or untreated wood. So porous surfaces must by physically removed and trashed to get rid of the mycotoxins. If you cannot physically remove it (like untreated wood that is a part of your houses' foundation), you must physically sand the mold off while using a HEPA vacuum to clean it all up.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15238314/

Could you epoxy seal everything?

Sealing works well if there is not visible mold growth on the item. So like think about sealing an art canvas in a home that had mold in it, but the art canvas was in the living room and the mold colony was in the bathroom under the shower. In that case, any sort of light sealant would trap any possible residual mycotoxins on the canvas so they will no longer float around the air in the home.

But if you have mold growing on unpainted wood joists, for example, because of a plumbing leak, you can't just paint over the mold colony on those joists with a sealant, because it may not penetrate deep enough into the wood, and you can't paint the backside of that joist where it touches the floor / ceiling, and so the mold often will just continue to grow and grow around your sealant. Many paints marketed as mold killers and sealers are totally ineffective at stopping the problem in scenarios like this.

Just a warning to anyone reading this that 35% lab grade hydrogen peroxide can be VERY dangerous, so I'd just stick to the 2% drug store stuff unless you really know what you're doing.

High purity hydrogen peroxide has been used as a rocket fuel since it's such a great oxidizer.

>13. Bleach doesn't kill mold. It only turns it white. Hydrogen Peroxide does kill it. You can by concentrated hydrogen peroxide from a lab supply store (we buy 35% and dilute it to 3.5% for everyday cleaning). Spray it onto surfaces in a fine mist (don't soak things) and leave it for 5 minutes. At this point it's mostly stabilized into water that you can wipe away with a paper towel or cloth.

Bleach does kill mold but the concentrations of bleach required will also damage the surfaces that it's on.

Bleach can kill mold, but often will not even in high concentrations as mold can live in things that do not absorb bleach.

> (Aspergillus, the Penicillin mold)

the Penicillin mold would be Penicillium, Aspergillus is used to make Soya Sauce and Sake.

Aspergillis is commonly known as mildew. It's black.

Aspergillis is a whole host of different molds. They can be all different colours.

See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspergillus#/media/File:Four_3...

Thanks for the clarification. I’m mostly repeating from (sometimes bad) memory my conversation with a mold inspector from a few weeks ago.

regarding 12 -- some mold remediation procedures are relatively DIY friendly once you have a bit of knowledge on the subject

regarding 13 - now I'm confused. we're telling people how to clean mold when in #12 we're telling people not to clean mold. the whole piece here implying it can just be wiped away should be removed. simplifying mold cleanup like this is what leads to bad DIY jobs.

That isn’t what I meant to imply, but you’re not wrong. We use the peroxide as a general cleaner, which both sanitizes and also kills mold on surfaces.

This is all so bizarre to me. You would all die horrible deaths in the tropics, where you take care not to leave your laundry wet and unwashed too long so it doesn't get mold, but don't give it a second though beyond that. Mold is just a fact of life, like wind and sunshine.

> 12. DO NOT try to clean mold yourself

SMH this is like saying don't clean your house, don't bathe, etc. Mold is everywhere, don't think about it. Unless you're immunocompromised or have an allergy, it's completely harmless.

Mold is hardly completely harmless. Please do not spread harmful misinformation.

Homeowners insurance only covers damage from specific perils, like sudden water damage, fire, wind damage from a storm.

You say that, but there’s literally a line on my policy that states a coverage amount for mold remediation…

You'd be surprised at how thorough homeowners insurance is. Mine covers accidental damage to electronics (i.e. "dropped my laptop"). It's not worth making a claim because of deductible and rate increases, but it's in there.

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