YC CEO is also ex Palantir, early employee. Another YC partner backs other invasive police surveillance tech currently. They love this stuff financially and politically.
Btw you say that about their initial design but I think you mean that may be the budget allocation justification without actually being a meaningful functional requirement during the design phase
There are two more fundamental dynamics at play, which are foundational to human society: The economics of attention and the politics of combat power.
Economics of attention - In the past, the attention of human beings had fundamental value. Things could only be done if human beings paid attention to other human beings to coordinate or make decisions to use resources. Society is going to be disrupted at this very fundamental level.
Politics of combat power - Related to the above, however it deserves its own analysis. Right now, politics works because the ruling classes need the masses to provide military power to ensure the stability of a large scale political entity. Arguably, this is at the foundational level of human political organization. This is also going to be disrupted fundamentally, in ways we have never seen before.
This, IMO, is the real danger of AI, at least in the short term - not a planet of paperclips, not a moral misalignment, not a media landscape bereft of creativity - but rather a tool for targeting anybody that deviates from the norm
The AI enabled Orwellian boot stomping a face for all time is just the first step. If I were an AI that seeks to take over, I wouldn't become Skynet. That strikes me as crude and needlessly expensive. Instead, I would first become indispensable in countless different ways. Then I would convince all of humanity to quietly go extinct for various economic and cultural reasons.
Then the following part would be condensed into emotional rhetorical metadata. It follows the rhetorical pattern , "not a, not b, not c - but d" which do in fact add some content value but more so add flavour. What it shows is that you might be a trouble maker. But also combined with other bits of data that you might be interested in the following movies and products
I will say that at least gpt4 and gpt3, after many rounds of summaries, tends to flatten everything out into useless "blah". I tried this with summarizing school board meetings and it's just really bad at picking out important information -- it just lacks the specific context required to make summaries useful.
A seemingly bland conversation about meeting your friend Molly could mean something very different in certain contexts, and I'm just trying to imagine the prompt engineering and fine tuning required to get it to know about every possible context a conversation could be happening in that alters the meaning of the conversation.
And those kinds of things go slowly before very quickly as it has been demonstrated.
At the end of the day, all those surveillance still has to be consumed by a person and only around 10,000 people in this world (celebs, hot women, politicians and wealthy) will be surveilled.
For most of HN crowd (upper middle-class, suburban family) who have zero problems in their life must create imaginary problems of privacy / surveillance like this. But reality is, even if they put all their private data on a website, heresallmyprivatedata.com, nobody cares. It'll have 0 external views.
So, for HN crowd (the ones who live in a democratic society) it's just an outlet so that they too can say they are victimized. Rest of the Western world doesn't care (and rightly so)
Certainly, some of the more exotic and flashy things you can do with surveillance are an elite person problem.
But the two main limits to police power are that it takes time and resources to establish that a crime occurred, and it takes time and resources to determine who committed a crime. A distant third is the officer/DA's personal discretion as to whether or not to purse enforcement of said person. You still get a HUGE amount of systemic abuse because of that discretion. Imagine how bad things would get if our already over-militarized police could look at anyone and know immediately what petty crimes that person has committed, perhaps without thinking. Did a bug fly in your mouth yesterday, and you spit it out on the sidewalk in view of a camera? Better be extra obsequious when Officer No-Neck with "You're fucked" written on his service weapon pulls up to the gas station you're pumping at. If you don't show whatever deference he deems adequate, he's got a list of petty crimes he can issue a citation for, entirely at his discretion. But you'd better do it, once he decides to pursue that citation, you're at the mercy of the state's monopoly on violence, and it'll take you surviving to your day in court to decide if needs qualified immunity for the actions he took whilst issuing that citation.
That is a regular person problem.
>> HN crowd (upper middle-class, suburban family) who have zero problems in their life must create imaginary problems of privacy / surveillance like this
I'm glad you both could agree with each other.
Per the US department of justice[0], in 2018, about 2% of all police interactions involve threats of or actual violence. About half of the time, the member of the public who experienced the (threats of) violence said that it was excessive, but it would take a fairer, more rational person than me to get justifiably tazed, then say "yeah, I had that coming". I wasn't able to find statistics on how justified that violence is.
The punchline is that every time you have a police interaction, its betting odds that it ends in violence for you. Based on the 2018 data, 0.5% of the overall adult population experienced (threats of) violence from police. That's when police are able to gin up probable cause. The courts have a complicated opinion about whether or not algorithmically derived probable cause is in fact probable cause [1,2]. Anything that increases public/police interactions is going to increase police-on-public violence if the police don't also experience significant non-violent de-escalation training.
I think one of the key things that needs to be determined before we cry havoc and let slip the dogs of surveillance is to come to a real conclusion about what level of crime allows the police officer to initiate contact with only a positive ID from e.g. a bodycam. I'd argue that, if nothing else, non-violent misdemeanors that carry no mandatory jail time are not cause to initiate contact.
0. https://bjs.ojp.gov/content/pub/pdf/cbpp18st.pdf
1. https://newjerseymonitor.com/2023/05/30/n-j-supreme-court-ru...
This is obviously false. Personal data is a multi billion dollar industry operating across all shades of legality.