'Everything indicates' Chinese ship damaged Baltic pipeline on purpose | Hacker News Reader

'Everything indicates' Chinese ship damaged Baltic pipeline on purpose

politico.eu

38 pointsksec17 comments

I don’t understand what motivation there would be.

The obvious beneficiaries are the Ukrainians. It makes it hard for the rissians to promise to turn on those taps and forces the Germans to make a one-way shift away from such a deep dependence on Russian gas.

There is no reason for the Russians to do this. I suppose some Baltic state might have some incentive, to keep the Germans from wavering, but I’m not sure any of them have the capability or willingness to take such a risk.

And China? What could they gain?

The pipelines here have nothing to do with Germany, they go between Finland and Estonia, and aren't particularly critical. Finland just joined NATO, so there's your motivation - harassment.

Before Finland joined NATO Russian military planes would regularly violate our airspace, just to show that they can. Of course now under NATO they will try to annoy us even more. China is anti-NATO, so they are fine with this.

If you believe that China would like to turn Russia into a puppet state, or that they would like to prolong Russia’s war in Ukraine for as long as possible (to bleed the West before China invades Taiwan later in the decade), then reducing Russia’s income from the West while also making energy more expensive for the West seems like maybe a good plan?

I dunno, it feels a bit beyond what China has done before.

But if this was an American ship having damaged a pipeline between Chinese allies in East Asia, we would say, sure, I can imagine the Americans wanting to harm China’s allies, I’m just surprised they used an American ship to do it.

So yeah, why not?

This isn't Nordstream, this is Balticconnector. Different pipeline in a different place and it was damaged a couple months ago this year, whereas Nordstream was blown up in 2022.

For the sabotage of the Nord Stream pipelines I absolutely support your reasoning. The Russians lost the strategic option of blackmailing Germany into political submission in case of a harsh winter. Strategically they are on the losing side of that incident.

Here I'm not so sure. But it smacks a bit of scape goating the most popular scape goat.

Cheap gas from Russia maybe?

What worries me is that there seem to be no consequences for the ship for this destruction of infrastructure since it was in "international waters"

If I start breaking all undersea cables in the oceans one by one, will I face any consequences? Is there a line somewhere, where breaking one or two cables is fine?

Article 27 of the UN convention on the high seas stipulates that all signatories treat this as a crime if their subjects or flag-bearers do it, so it's hardly a free for all.

Although, typically, the USA has refused to ratify it. Maybe you'd be fine!

There has to be some kind of precedent in established international maritime law. There's nothing new under the sun.

China is the main beneficiary of the war between Russia and Ukraine. Nobody is talking anymore about COVID lab leak and instead Russians are buying more and more things from China and sends cheapest raw materials to China in return. So they have an interest in stirring up tensions even more. Anyone remember this guy:

https://youtu.be/8fwgVUfW_O4

Not really... announcing that you have an unlimited friendship with Russia really hurts your reputation amongst the countries that you need to export to if you are China.

Can Chinas reputation be worse than it already is? People make business with China not because of its good reputation, but because of greed. They want to profit from cheap labor and one of the biggest markets in the world. I have never heard that any company chooses to go to China because of its good reputation e.g. for human rights or it's freedom or it's favorable political system. I don't think China cares about its reputation in any way.

This is not a very good article:

> No culprit has been identified for the Nord Stream attack despite an international investigation

Wrong. The culprit is generally understood to be the US via allies. It is not disputed.

Further, for the Balticconnector, the article assumes that an anchor was dragged. It has not been shown. It seems to be a theory or a fabrication. It is convenient that they accuse a country far away that aren't really bothered much by the accusations by such small countries.

This is very much disputed. In fact currently nobody thinks the North Stream attack was carried out by the US. There is good evidence for Ukraine having done it and it has been reconstructed in detail my German media. Additionally Germany is choosing to ignore the issue as much as possible (and rightfully so).

Those "Ukrainians" that they point to were known russian agents.

Folks, we know it was us. There's no doubt now - not that there ever was doubt - no doubt now that we blew that pipeline. No one is disputing that. World leaders call me all the time at Mar-a-lago - great place by the way, beautiful links, fantastic seafood - they call me all the time, they say "President Trump, we have evidence, it was the US, America blew up Nordstream". They know it, you know it, we all know, without a doubt, that we're to blame. - Trump, probably

you are missing the /s tag

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