Judge Rules Tesla Knew of Autopilot Dangers Before Fatal Crash, but Did Nothing | Hacker News Reader

Judge Rules Tesla Knew of Autopilot Dangers Before Fatal Crash, but Did Nothing

thedrive.com

68 pointsdkjaudyeqooe12 comments

Of course they knew. The engineers knew, Elon knew. They aren't stupid. I know some Tesla people. They all know.

Elon is a great showman. That's not an attack it's just the truth. The judge is right, Elon did use "doublespeak" and intentionally misleading statements to push autopilot.

How are these people so comfortable with negligent homicide?

They must tell themselves that what they're working on is so 'important' that it's ok that someone (else) dies.

>>How are these people so comfortable with negligent homicide?

They have some ethical defense in their head that absolves them of all of this, like "we believe our cars are much safer to use than normal cars, so the fact that sometimes they kill people through our mistakes is irrelevant, they are a net positive anyway".

I hate how the logic adds up but can you actually argue with the ends?

Yes, you can. Ends do not justify means.

You're right, I just always wonder since that trolley or whatever problem like "kill 1" vs "kill 5" but even "kill 2" is already a perfect microcosm of the inherent difficulty, philosophically speaking, in terms of the way or the standards on which we prioritize and enumerate the "value" of individual human beings.

I'm not sure if that sentence "works" but I think you'll arrive at what I'm saying "in the end" ;)

The more interesting questions to me, legally speaking: 1. Who was their General Counsel at the time? 2. Were they consulted regarding all of this? 3. What was their documented legal advice regarding same? 4. Did Tesla deviate or depart from the advice? 5. Who (provide an array[]stamped their name on that decision).

So for example, say we're talking about Trump: do your own research but ask these questions and you'll be presumably on your way to thinking like a prosecutor.

Can you prove that letting subautomatic cars kill people is necessary to achieve level 5 automation? Because we aren't close, and "the ends" thus far is stuffing Elon's pocketbook.

Except that all of those claims are based on an understanding of statistics that would barely pass middle school. "Miles on a subset of conditions that were sufficient so as to not deactivate systems" is not "miles in all conditions".

Seems like the headline is misleading. He ruled that there was reasonable evidence that that was the case and a trial can proceed.

It's not like he issued a judgement against them

From the article:

The suit stems from a crash that occurred in 2019 outside Miami, Florida. Stephen Banner was driving his Tesla Model 3 with Autopilot active when a semi truck pulled out across the road. Banner's Tesla, set to travel at 69 mph, detected neither Banner's hands on its steering wheel nor the presence of the stationary trailer in its path, according to The Washington Post. The car traveled under the trailer, ripping off its roof and killing Banner.

Banner's wife filed a lawsuit in the Circuit Court for Palm Beach County, which Judge Reid Scott ruled last week could proceed to trial. Judge Scott reportedly cited a video published by Tesla in 2016 wherein the company claimed "the car is driving itself," but didn't give "any indication that the video is aspirational or that this technology doesn't currently exist in the market." Tesla employees later revealed the demonstration was staged.

Also in that same video:

“The person in the driver's seat is only there for legal reasons. He is not doing anything.”

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