Tesla Model 3 fault rate is the highest of any car: report
cleanenergyrevolution.co
cleanenergyrevolution.co
The cars are really not that reliable and if you get in a fender bender no regular body shop can help you. If worse you are likely completely fucked with costs going into the many thousands very quickly. Not to mention waiting for months on repair.
Also the resell value after a few years is awful. The most popular reseller site has so so many available.
Tesla's in my opinion are a luxury vehicle but unlike other car luxury vehicles. They are a luxury because they are like a smart phone. Once it is too old or broken, you throw it away and the money is gone entirely.
I check all the time and the used market (on 3 and Y) isn't nearly cheap enough to opt out of a brand new model with full warranty
And because of the reliability issues, the full warranty is quite valuable (in the short term at least)
-- my 2015 S battery dies literally the day after the 8y warranty ended. $15k to replace with a refurbished battery AND forfeit my battery to them to resell it. The trade in value of the car, assuming it worked, was only $20k.
1. https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/10/26/hertz-pulls-back-on-ev-p...
2. Hertz’s issue is that they bought (some of) their Teslas and then Tesla dropped the price of new vehicles significantly. So even if Hertz never rented them out and had them in a showroom, they already have lost money on resale value.
https://jalopnik.com/hertz-tesla-rental-fleet-costs-deprecia...
When I, as a Ford owner, need the bi-annual TUV inspection, I go to a Ford dealer to let them take care of it. They will pre-inspect the car for me (and usually I let them also do the annual maintenance at the same time), and they will fix any issues before the TUV inspector sees it. That's cheaper for me, because I don't have to pay TUV twice (even if the fee for re-inspections is lower), I always get my car back on the same day, and it's also much better for Ford, because the car won't show up in TUV reports.
Tesla doesn't have a dealership network like Ford or the other big brands. I guess most owners will just drive to the TUV station, without pre-inspection, and thus their cars will end up in the report.
For the same reason, value brands show up more often in the TUV reports. Their owners often don't go to dealerships and don't stick to the maintenance plan, but drive to TUV directly or go to smaller garages which don't do the pre-inspection.
> According to DIGITIMES, the high Tesla Model 3 fault rate can be attributed to Tesla’s decision to cease defining service intervals in 2019. The limited availability of Tesla service centers is another key factor.
> Although the TÜV SÜD report is specific to Germany, Tesla’s lack of service centers is a global problem. Tesla currently has 186 service centers in the US. By comparison, there are almost 3,000 Ford service centers.
1) List the cars in the oldest category (12+ years from memory)
2) Find the most reliable which is a car which meets your needs
3) buy 12+ year old car for $2-3k
4) enjoy reliable cheap motoring. I'm driving a 2005 mercedes right now which cost next to nothing, has done 200k+ miles and feels like it's brand new. Thanks TUV
7) Do not care too much about burning fossil fuel just because rich hypocrites are trying to offload environmental responsibility to the most vulnerable ones
I'm not against you, but I disagree with this point. It's one that people often make, so I feel the need to comment:
Buying a new car doesn't add another car to the waste bin; buying a new car simply adds one more car to the pool of used cars, thus reducing the price of used cars by an infinitesimal amount, and simultaneously raising the price of new cars an infinitesimal amount. In either scenario the amount of waste is unchanged.
What does lead to more car waste is cheaper new cars, which reduces the value advantage of buying a used car; exactly what we see with consumer electronics. The answer to that problem is to make the cars themselves greener, electric being the best choice at the moment.
There's no info on the report and methodology.
I hear nothing but good reports from people who own these cars. And given the current media attack against Elon, I prefer to verify negative claims.
Many of the sensors in a $200,000 Maybach and a $20,000 Civic all come from the same battle tested catalogues from a few companies (like Bosch, Continental, etc.)
Tesla prides themselves on replacing those battle tested components with in-house alternatives with no where near the widespread applications or history to shake out bugs in order to save themselves some money.
I'm not sure why people think the EV part is what makes Tesla's margins when we've commoditized ICEs to the moon and back: it's the making a cheaper car part that does. You don't get to do that for free.
Yeah there's a laundry list but in my experience the people who comment like what I replied to will have excuses for all that
The only technique that ever gets some semblance of acceptance is using Tesla's own claims as proof (since everything else is an anti-Elon conspiracy theory)
I hear only but good reports from people that are iphone fans. Thats normal, no one want to admit himself that he have done not a good deal.
Joking aside could there be a difference in the German Tesla factories vs. other countries? I'm digging into knitty-gritty, but maybe because it just doesn't match real life reviews.
The closest to a source that I can find (and read) is: https://www.tuvsud.com/en-us/press-and-media/2023/november/r...
It's a standardized test. If your car fails you have a few weeks to get it fixed and present your car again.
So you have dozens of millions of cars being checked every year by standardized criteria. That gives extremely reliable statistics.
I would have thought the battery or the powertrain or some EV-specific component would be the source of the problems. Does anybody know why these more seemingly standardized parts are failing at higher rates?
Both VW and Tesla have been making EV-specific components for about the same amount of time (not long), but VW has something like 70 years more experience than Tesla in making brakes (edit: integrating brakes into cars, fine)
I'm sure you could have read "make" charitably as "making and/or integrating brakes into cars" if you wanted to.
I can sorta understand wanting to bring something bespoke like seats in house, but friction brakes are commodity hardware. If Tesla is trying to DIY friction brakes that seems like a colossal waste of time.
And assembling brakes
https://www.autoevolution.com/news/another-tesla-is-delivere...
I'd never experienced that before, or heard of others who had experienced it.
Compare that to van drivers or sports car owners or car veterans that are slow adopters, who might catch a cars problem earlier and get it fixed before a safety test. Heck, just the fact that regular cars go into mechanics to get services more regularly will lead to problems being caught before a safety test.
This doesn't really say that Teslas have more problems, more so that Teslas drive around with problems for longer than other types of cArs.
I’m interested in hearing more about that argument.
Tesla will sue people who tinker with their cars. Thats not exactly compatible with “car enthusiast“.
Getting work done has always taken a long time too, and that has only changed in the last few months.
First, they are talking about a 221-car sample; that seems extremely low and looks like it has been cherry picked from among all the possibilities to make Tesla look as bad as possible. Second, we are talking about Germany; a country that has a whole political arm related to building and selling car, in particular luxury, a segment where Tesla has been beating them in some factors recently. You can feel the bitterness through the screen. Third, I would expect a 10-year-old car manufacturer with brand new tech to have reliability a bit worse than an established manufacturer with old proven tech. But they don't even talk about the real cost or total cost of ownership anyway, so it is like guessing and comparing.
And they tout WV as reliable, which is kind of funny as everyone who really has own a WV will tell you, especially after the cheating scandal. I guess they are reliable as long as you don't care about electronics... And the electric Golf they are mentioning is not even produced anymore. My father's partner had an e-UP and was extremely unhappy with it so...
It seems like classic Tesla hate and I don't even care because I think most people should not even get a car or that a car at those prices do not make sense. But if you are going to spend that much money on a car, Tesla is hardly the worst choice...
> TUV SUD is a Germany-headquartered company offering testing and certification services. It did 10.2 million times of regular testing on 221 vehicle models between July 2022 and June 2023.
The rest is still valid. There is such a strong irrational Tesla hate by many that it's hard to take "reports" seriously. I feel it is prevalent in the general public as well.
In fact, I feel the same hate people had for Apple right before and at the start of the iPod era. At that people were saying to me all kind of nonsense because I was using Apple products. Now Apple is most valuable company in the world so I'm laughing my ass off. Even more hilariously, nowadays I believe they are abusing their reputation and unfairly milking people. Careful what you wish for I guess...
Still there is a lot of shit-talk about Tesla and most of it is nonsense. In particular I would ignore most of what come of out of Germany, they are scared shitless and clearly have a lot to gain by damaging Tesla reputation. I wish they would focus on producing better cars at cheaper price (when price matched, current German cars sort of suck compared to rest of the market but they won't let you tell that of course).
Heavy powerful car is rough on the chassis and suspension. News at 11.
Basically Tesla made a sedan with insane torque using normal sedan parts, but it weighs more like an SUV because of the battery weight. They should've used reinforced parts, but that would've been more expensive.