Comment by bad_user | Hacker News Reader

Comment by bad_user | Hacker News Reader

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I don't know about the others, but Greece tends to be a transit country, not a final destination. It does get immigrants, but those interested in crime tend to migrate to higher-GDP countries. I can see the same trend in my country too. The people coming here, for now, are very hardworking and law-abiding, whereas those interested in crime tend to migrate, our natives included, too.

It's good to know that immigrants, no matter the nationality, ethnicity, or religion, follow a normal distribution. Some of them are criminals or bigots, whereas most of them are just normal people trying to find work and raise a family.

Europe needs immigrants, it would be foolish to close borders. But we need to be tougher on crime, too. Immigrants that don't quickly adopt our laws and liberal values should be expelled because otherwise, the crime rate goes up, then far-right parties take over. And what happens next in such scenarios is that the law-abiding immigrants suffer, actually.

Immigrants are rarely much of a crime problem. First and second generation descendants on the other hand... there really aren't any simple solutions, at least not as long as we agree that an individual cannot be punished for a statistic about their future descendants.

This is factually not true, and you can easily see it in the correlation between waves of immigrants and the crime rates going immediately up. We aren't talking about just organized crime, but also petty crime, rape, etc.

Usually, after 2 generations, most people adopt the local culture. You can see it in quite tangible metrics, like, for example, they stop having many children, with the fertility rate dropping to the Western average. And if first and second generation descendants become a problem, indeed, then we can talk about society being broken, and the solution is to fix it, not to stop immigration.

For me, talking about slowing down immigration is like talking about slowing down the economy. It can't be done without people eventually starving.

Can you give 1 example where the solution you suggest has worked in the long term? i.e.: my population pyramid is broken, I am going to replace the base of the pyramid with foreigners.

I do not have a problem with that idea, but bringing people from territories where marrying your 1st cousin is legal is a bad idea with bad consequences: lower IQ, expensive health conditions, bad temperament (and hence crime), etc.

> bringing people from territories where marrying your 1st cousin is legal is a bad idea with bad consequences

Like half the US? (and the map for that looks probably exactly opposite what you're thinking right now: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cousin_marriage_law_in_the_Uni... )

I think you describe the ideological framework that immigrants in the U.S. have. Because they've had to work hard to integrate they value what they've acquired and work hard to uphold it. The result is they increase social cohesion by their adherence to the country's shared myths/ideals, and as they must generally pursue economic integration are economically productive as well.

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