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Comment by shortrounddev2 | Hacker News Reader

Personally I hate the fact that libraries have become de facto homeless shelters. It gives them a constant background noise of danger and a lot of these people just sit around watching softcore porn on youtube. I think you'd see more library attendance if the places felt safer to leave kids at alone

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I spent a decade as a public library board member.

I saw every possible combination of anti-social behavior from the homeless that would encamp there. Many times I had to 'assist' asking someone to leave. The librarians _could_ have called the cops and had the violators permanently barred from re-entering but they would rarely do that.

It is 100% scaring away families and elderly.

It’s interesting how we (as a culture) tolerate people who have broken the social contract. As Americans we’ve really let the bottom fall out. They’re so far away from society they do not care anymore about norms. And we do not care to do anything except let them exist in our spaces to the detriment of the public.

The costs they create far outweigh whatever a programme to help them would cost.

We're literally giving up on social activities and safety and trust because we're not willing to meaningfully address the down and outs.

It's a "problem" of a nonhomogeneous populous: the wide range in definition of what maintains the social contract.

For some, if they in particular aren't disturbed from their AirPods, murder or other crime is a-ok.

For others, if you wear the wrong ratty clothes into the library, you're breaking the social contract.

> For others, if you wear the wrong ratty clothes into the library, you're breaking the social contract.

This is a very bad faith re-statement of what I wrote about my experiences with the homeless in my library.

My comment was not referring, nor directed, to you.

It's easy to paint with a broad brush "'the homeless' = bad". That is as casually discriminatory as being antisemitic and is offensive. Perhaps some empathy and nuance would help rather than condemning a group of people for the actions of individuals.

You can broadly say that many homeless people engage in anti-social behavior, and therefore homelessness is a problem we should be motivated to solve even if we have no empathy for the homeless people themselves

Us and them rhetorical nonsense. I was homeless. I didn't flash or piss on the floor indoors. Perhaps you're conflating homelessness for a lack of mental healthcare.

I see where you're coming from and I honestly don't like it either. Some are disruptive, shout, smell bad, ...etc. But of all the times I've been to the library (any maybe I'm just lucky), I can only count a few instances I felt uneasy about the people I was around. Of the few times they did act out or pulled up porn; they were escorted out. I think that's mostly a consequence of how our city deals homelessness and our city should do better, but that's complete tangent.

To me a library is a public service that should serve all. To this day, after a decade living here, I've yet to find a cafe, bar, or any place to get free internet, a laptop, shelter, and a decently maintained public bathroom.

I just want to reiterate I agree with your frustration. I want the NYPL to be better, but it needs to serve everybody.

I agree but libraries are not a daycare either.

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