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Comment by bee_rider | Hacker News Reader

Non-replaceable batteries produce phones that become waste more quickly. Unfortunately, lots of e-waste just gets tossed out. This is a form of cost externalization.

If people want to buy phones with a non-replaceable battery, that is OK I guess, but we need of fee or deposit to prevent them from dropping that cost on the environment.

Edit: come to think of it, we probably also need a fee or deposit for replaceable batteries. But at least it could be smaller, since it is just for the battery. We probably don’t want a deposit for every piece of electronics, just because that would be annoying.

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What if I am fine with this minimal amount of waste? All the greenwashing by Apple and other companies does not reflect the actual material damage of the environment. Just like recycling doesn’t always make sense and it is highly situational. But ask anyone and it’s like a religion.

We need to get back to sensible environmentalism. Otherwise, you can justify pretty much anything.

I think what I’ve suggested is sensible environmentalism. Add a deposit, let the market sort it out. It is what we’ve done for lead acid car batteries, and it works pretty well, I think. Lead and acid are nasty things, but we recycle something like 99% of these batteries.

The issue isn’t whether or not you are fine with a little bit of waste. That little bit of waste has a cost. The cost is paid by the planet, not you, if the phone just winds up ina dump. I haven’t suggested banning phones without replaceable batteries, just making sure that you or your phone manufacturer somehow pay that cost.

We can put entire humanity's electronic items and plastic in a dump with minimal environmental impact.

Focus on bigger ticket items. The elephants in the room.

Better recycling will also help us mine less lithium and rare earth metals.

A replaceable battery just means I’m going to dump a phone with a replaceable battery into an e-waste landfill whenever I want a brand new phone.

I will absolutely not keep a phone any longer just because the battery can be replaced.

Yeah, as I mentioned in the edit, we should also have a deposit for the replaceable battery, but at least it could be smaller, since it is just for the battery.

What would convince you to keep a phone significantly longer?

Better phones stop being made.

Which new recent features are so important for you?

No dynamic island, periscope telephoto lens, USB-C. We are far from peak phone.

That happened a good few years ago really.

For a while, phones were gaining 50-100% performance per year and noticably better screens+cameras. Now it's down to a few percent and minor camera updates are the main selling point.

Nobody is arguing that you should keep a phone longer "just" because the battery can be replaced. You should keep a phone for longer because you want to keep the phone for longer. With a replaceable battery, you have that option.

Or you give the phone to someone that wants or needs the phone.

Reusability is about not being selfish.

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