Berlin's famed nightclubs, losing customers, face an uncertain future
npr.org
npr.org
These clubs were great while the city was struggling, but now that it’s not, I can see why people don’t wish to tolerate the negative externalities associated with them. Hopefully most clubs can find a way to integrate into today’s Berlin. Some may not be able to and disappear. Cities aren’t static beings.
I’ve also realized I prefer underground parties or small social gatherings to 3-hour lines, 40 euro entrance fees, and uncertain door policies.
Also, didn't it occur to anyone that charging regulars more to offset loss of business from casuals would drive the regulars away as well?
Perhaps, but it seems that those "selective" clubs have given a bad reputation to all clubs.
What kind of prep is required to go out to drink and fund someone else's business?
I will never be going as I am too old and too busy for the "scene" so please explain it to me in laymen terminology.
Why not? I was at a heavy metal concert in Shibuya last May, and the place was full of 50-something guys in full office suits. It was a Monday, so I guess they just finished work and went directly to the concert. It was quite amusing to be honest...
It's unfortunate that the rock and metal crowd is mostly middle-aged people these days; the young people seem to be listening to rather bland pop music, idol music, etc.
Being exclusive is really against the ethos of techno in Berlin. The "exclusivity" at the door is usually about achieving a fun mix of people and keeping out the ones who cannot behave.
As an occasional clubber in Berlin, these "best" things are ridiculous. The "best" kebab place with the long queue is nothing special at all, and Berghain is, apart from the building and the (mostly gay) sex stuff (which don't do much for me) a club like many others. It's never been my favorite - the vibe can be surprisingly aggressive and the music is often not that good for my taste. I used to go there for specific acts or along with friends only. Haven't bothered for years now. Nowadays it's also become expensive, cashing in on its dubious status.
There is a thing that the "best" kebab place and the "best" club have in common: kebab places and clubs are both very good in Berlin, so if you go to the one that the tourist guide / TikTok recommended, you're probably going to have a good time - but maybe you don't know that there are many other just as good or better places.
As for how restaurants compare to making food at home, I don't think almost any restaurant can do better than a good chef at home. Someone at home can concentrate on making a top-quality meal for one or two people (maybe a couple more at the most), and doesn't have any real time pressures, or needing to share kitchen resources with meals made for dozens of other customers. It's pretty much the ideal environment for cooking, assuming 1) the equipment available is good and 2) the chef is skilled enough. Of course, #2 is a big one, so while some people who are confident in their cooking skills can claim "I can cook better meals than most Michelin-starred restaurants!", lots of other people can't cook meals that require more skill than "put in microwave for 4 minutes" so most restaurants can easily beat that.
I was rejected at Kater Blau once though, for who knows what reason. It's the way it works, if you get bumped you can get angry at the system or just forget your ego and go elsewhere and enjoy the night.
My experience of KitKat is that unwanted attention of any kind (which depending on the night might not be super rare) is quickly shut down by the people in the immediate area before the staff even get close, and then the staff respond very quickly to it, especially if someone who is a regular calls attention.
The scene is prone to issues and what we do in my town is not allowing new people unless they have a fet account and/or accompanied by a regular. There's also a blacklist of known offenders. Not sure if that's the case over there.
I really hope I can visit it one day but I'm really afraid of travelling all the way there and being refused..
Ps regarding Lindemann I'm not a big fan of cancelling people before the facts come out. I absolutely abhor abuse but I'm also very much in favour of innocent until proven guilty.
It wouldn't really be a risk of him misbehaving because there's so many eyes on him. But I know it's a tough line to draw. Glad I'm not a club manager.
Traveling to Asia, South America and Europe to meet with electronic artists I've never had any interest in attempting to go to the segregated clubs of Berlin. I find it offensive.
There's plenty of ones that don't discriminate.
Your other options are (a) let anyone in and you get a**** and total dilution of cultural values (quick death of the institution) or (b) it's a private party and you're not invited.
For accessible and good, you can stay on your toes and find new, smaller clubs and scenes that haven't had time to die yet, but that's its own exclusiveness: if you don't know, you don't know.
I'd argue the majority of cliques and scenes are extremely accepting and people self filter. Having a discriminating door guy is just being an asshole.
But this approach just wouldn't benefit some popular dance clubs. Without a solid door policy clubs would be stuffed with people who come there for wrong reasons. To pick up girls, to get drunk, to visit an attraction for the sake of a visit (not because they enjoy techno music), to get into a fight, etc etc. Have you ever been to a poorly managed club? They don't have a community, don't focus on a holistic clubbing experience, have many people with really bad vibes. Would you want to stay there for a night and the next day (night time + day time raves)?
> underground cliques
Let's be honest, techno is not underground in Berlin, these clubs are a massive tourist attraction. Berghain is not a 50 person dive bar in SOMA.
In Germany. Let me guess, they look at your ID to check your name and nationality first. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but I bet I'm not.
Btw, KitKatClub doesn't do that and they're equally famous.
Door policy is discrimination only in the sense that the very few people at the door have to make a swift judgment on whether your group will fit in. Can this be upsetting? Sure!
> In Germany. Let me guess, they look at your ID to check your name and nationality first.
By this logic liquor stores in the US also discriminate based on person's nationality since they check the ID.
KitKatClub has a strict dress code policy for their sex-oriented events.
As to the other point, you can separate the process to avoid the kind of blanket discrimination I think we can all agree is unethical. I bet they don't make the slightest effort. It's probably one guy that checks your ID and says yes/no and one guy that takes money. It could be 3 instead of 2 to avoid, just to be crazy, saying no to all the Jewish names, but it's not.
Next time I'm in Berlin, I'll try to remember to take a clicker with me and stand outside the place. I bet you'll start to notice a few interesting patterns that America has quite a few laws against. I've only heard them to be extremely proud of their bias so I'd be surprised if you didn't start seeing just classic discrimination because that's what humans appear to naturally do unless they work really really hard at it or have some structures to prevent it.
Community and scale do not mix. If the founders truly cared about community they would have wound the place up in about 2010 and done something new.
But once people experience a bit of success greed inevitably takes over…
Why is this so hard to understand?
However, all of them are fairly self-selecting in different ways that I think are difficult or impossible to achieve in a long-running, ostensibly "for everyone" institution like a techno club.
You can be exclusive for exclusive-sake and you'll attract the dolce & gabana crowd and maybe that's what they want - people who will spend $500 on alcohol.
But as far as techno I've met all the Belleville 3, two of them twice and each time it's been at tiny spots with like $0-$5 cover.
I've even been to warehouse parties with producers big enough to have Wikipedia pages that are just honor systems where you promise to venmo the promoter and there is no door guy. Highschool kids could just walk in doing hard drugs and to be honest they probably did.
But then again, there's certainly pop techno and non-pop techno. Tiestos YouTube has like 3.7 billion views. That's a different problem than say Legowelt with 200k.
Pay attention to the downvotes, and browse HN with "showdead" turned on, and you'll see that HN stays the way it is in large part due to aggressive exclusion of those who can't stick to society norms up to an including the metaphorical "door guy" (bans).
Self-filtering is a start. But pretty much all cliques and scenes also have lines you will get ostracised if you go past. The extent of their reaction if you will vary, and sure, there's a difference between proactively judging you based on appearance and retroactively judging you by actions, but in some scenes your appearance is part of the game. That sucks if you don't fit in, but it also sucks for those who want something specific if you're that one person who can't self filter and insist on ruing the experience for everyone else.
It's a very important difference.
If I, just some random dude, submitted a correct mathematical paper solving a millennium or Hilbert puzzle to a prestigious journal, for instance, they would publish it regardless of the fact that I'm not so and so from Princeton. They wouldn't exclude my valued contribution.
Discrimination would be me submitting the correct solution but first having to find and tack on so and so from Princeton as the author in order to even get considered.
Now I'd probably have to wrangle them a bit to convince them, but that's just credulity, not discrimination.
That's quite different than say Hattie McDaniel, a black actress, being excluded from the premiere of her movie, Gone with the Wind and unable to accept her Oscar on stage because of discrimination.
Discrimination exists regardless of contribution for reasons ultimately unrelated to the nature of the contribution
The specific comment you replied to that I replied to did not argue for the kind of discrimination you're talking about here either.
I'm absolutely sure that the kind of discrimination you're talking about is also an issue with quite a few clubs, but they are two very different issues.
You can tell me it's some vibe check but it's structurally set up to discriminate based on classic markers and there's been intentionally zero remediations to avoid it.
In fact, many reports of xenophobia, antisemitism and racism persist, just Google it, it's everywhere.
That's why we had to fundamentally re-form our institutions in the US in the name of inclusion and not just have better intentions.
Berghain and Tresor can to whatever the fuck they want, I don't care. But let's call a spade a spade and not pretend it magically turns to something else based on wishes and dreams.
> That's why we had to fundamentally re-form our institutions in the US in the name of inclusion and not just have better intentions.
Are you suggesting that worked?
> But let's call a spade a spade and not pretend it magically turns to something else based on wishes and dreams.
The problem is that you appear to call a spade something else entirely, and attack a position nobody has taken. I note that you have expanded on specific issues and pointed out another club that has specific policies that can be easily conformed to elsewhere, and that was a much more productive line of argument to take.
Yes and it is a pretty good description of most Berliners. As a capital, that has mainly lived the last 30 years by sucking tremendous money out of the other federal states, as a city that has little industry and businesses left, as a place which administration has become dysfunctional, it gives the stupid arrogant little Berliner a feeling or superiority if he gets into a club but others must stay outside.
And before you donwvote me, for many years I loved this city. I caught a last glimpse of the post reunification Berlin, when basically all the good clubs had no license or whatever. Bars and clubs at the craziest places. Took the police years to close this down. And today, if you walk through Prenzlauer Berg or Oranienburger str. OMG.
The counterargument to your point is somewhat self-evident: all the great nightclubs in Berlin that have way more relaxed entrances than Berghain that aren't filled with assholes and aren't completely diluted of cultural values.
Often times it's the exclusivity that attracts the assholes who normally don't listen to that kind of music anyway.
I've got no interest in discriminating against the discriminators
In fact, when I got in one club a very cute german girl tried to talk to me on the dancefloor. But I didn't speak any German and she got angry, shouting "aaauuggh!! tourists!!!"
Also, for the clubs that forbid alcohol (hard drugs only!), they will refuse you if you are caught drinking in line or are visibly drunk.
Also, I was told to keep my mouth shut as they will sometimes refuse you if you speak English
At least this is how it was about 13 years ago. My friend was a self-described and un-ironic "hipster", who kept his finger on the pulse of the local underground, and of course he lived in Kreuzberg
I think speaking English in itself was never a problem to get in. But of course the tourist vibes get stronger if the person doesn't know the "definition of cool" that is expected and appreciated in that particular club.
Take this example [1] of a tourist they probably let in by accident and regretted it. :)
Some of them are open for example only between 2am and 8am with a nice variety of other drugs available.
The thing about Berlin clubs is they care very strongly about the vibe and being cool, and/or protecting those deep in psychedlics or other stuff. Aggressive, drunk assholes ruin that so they are verboten in some spots. The bars are all happily stocked with non-alcoholic selections. It's not America where you need to make money at all costs fuck the consequences.
Note that these are the same places that will reputedly dump you out the back door if you overdo it or OD, take from that what you will.
Also, I think you underestimate just how much the party scene loves Club Mate over there. That is what we drank instead. It pairs really nicely with molly!
I moved to Berlin to escape the political headaches in Poland while still being close to my family and friends, with no specific goal of partying here, as I've never liked clubs and dancing in general. But from hanging out with expats and sometimes joining them to themed parties in clubs, my takeout is that you have to spend a lot of money on clothing and appearance to show the bouncers that you really belong. Of course places like Berghain are completely random in that matter and the way you dress doesn't change anything (unless you really look like a tourist, I guess), but for most part it's a rich kids club.
don't be drunk or on the way to getting drunk.
#1 pay attention. be there & listen.
#2 don't be too cool for this. in that moment, he's head of security and you might be a reason to call the police or someone who'll cost the crowd too much attention for no return.
that's it.
And SF is in way worse shape.
Or I guess maybe you were referring to the value of their houses drop, in which case, probably, and I personally wouldn't be very troubled if I saw that.
Rich kids on Adderall who dream of startups and VC rounds do not qualify, no matter how much they pretend not to be finance jerk-offs in shorts and sandals, reality is not on the side of SF being the center of anything like this.
Any Rustbelt city has 100% more chances than SF and California in general.
I'd also argue that, by missing the boat (pun intended) on containerization and allowing the Port of Oakland to poach most of the shipping traffic, the city's original main economic engine shut down, and that the dotcom booms aside, SF's default mode for the past 60-70 years is "wretched hive of scum and villainy". The Summer of Love, the first counterculture to be called by that name, arose in Haight-Ashbury because the Haight was a slum at the time and a group of broke hippies could often band together to afford the rent on a house there.
Also if you look at my exact wording: I don't say it's going to happen, I say I would not be surprised to see it happen.
Clearly a culture worth preserving!
Maybe the clubs could do something to make it a bad environment to make TikTok videos, like bombing the place with extremely bright flashing lights at a frequency that humans can’t see but that interferes with most phone cameras?
https://hackaday.com/2020/02/28/using-ir-leds-to-hide-in-pla...
That plus Faraday mesh in the walls could help.
And there are areas in Berghain that are more like a sex/fetish club than a night club.
I've been to parties that have had signs on the bathroom banning acts that would make a vanilla person blush.
[1] https://old.reddit.com/r/redscarepod/comments/11nll0r/my_gir...
The stickers you see on the walls could have accumulated over month. The system usually works fine and you rarely see anyone taking photos. Certainly way less than in clubs without those stickers.
Kids these days may not need those scenes as much these days, since they're more open to people who are different. Much of the early rave scene was for people that didn't fit in, for whatever reason.
You'd wake up in a tree somewhere and everyone was friendly as hell. Volunteers would pick up afterwards.
Then a new mayor came in and ruined it all, locked it down, limited the area and basically killed the spirit of it.
I was younger sure but it was so much better. Applies to lots of things that get ruined.
Or is there some point where you think cohort "value in tradition" was different?
It's possible for them to believe that the techno/rave/DJ scene is worse now, and that other similar culture/social activities done now are not.
SF had many more fun venues when SOMA was underutilized industrial real estate available to promoters and artists. A counterculture needs cheap space.
A promoter friend told me after the first dot-com crash that half the twentysomethings had left SF and the other half were working their butts off to survive.
That might have happened in some particular scenes, but:
- the exact same thing kept on going, maybe shifted a bit to more underground things; I don't know what type of parties you are referring to, but the stuff I frequent has been using the same principle for a long time: it is often so that one cannot even see the DJ because they're covered in the decoration and/or the DJ is in the back of the place and people dance to the speakers in the front
- not all concerts are the same. I get what you mean about 'DJ in the spotlight' which is just somewhat saddening especially if they're just pushing some buttons or even faking it, but at least for me there is something about proper interaction between DJ or band and the crowd which I also really like. I have fond memories of small parties where we'd be going crazy in front of the DJ because they'd build this really nice story in the mix where we'd knew what was coming and they know we knew and that would lead to an even better feeling of togetherness. So even though they're in the front they'd actually be part of the crowd as well.
there's your problem, you're not there.
there are other things happening in the crowd. all you see are tall guys with the longest arms holding up their phones taking videos of other phones.
If you want to look into this more:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WauGLIefYrg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xk6wqKqygDw
watch with subs if needed.
Some fucking great times.
Fucked my hearing though, wear earplugs at the rave, kids.
There seems to be a psycho-social aspect to these generational agitations, whatever new thing the young ones bring will always be seen in the worst possible way by their elders in every generation.
Hardcore shows at squats still live on though, and people are there to enjoy for sure. But that's because if you don't like the music and setting you would leave pretty quickly.
I tend to think this kind of self-filtering system is more effective than bouncers at the door, but at the same time, consumers be consumin, and they glom onto faddy subcultures just long enough to completely hollow them out. There's arguments to be made for curating the spaces that art resides and thrives in.
If a genre, or ideal, "curates" to the next generation, is it even still that ideal? Is that not still just fading away, or at worst, selling out?
In my experience in the scene, these types of people enter these spaces looking to be seen and aren't really there for the music (think taking flash photos of themselves in front of the DJs, taking up space on the dancefloor not dancing or vibing to the music, etc).
I have strong opinions on this, but don't get me wrong, there's a bit of gatekeeping for a good reason. The point is that people who are actually interested in the scene are more likely to respect it and contribute to the involved communities. Whereas a tik-tok raver's interest is likely fleeting and uninformed about the spaces they occupy.
Don’t get me wrong, I still like those kind of partying as well from time to time, but treating an average rave as a dress up dancing is way too much work for me. Also underground scene pretty much everywhere in the world is extremely alive and doing well, but became so much more protective of itself for the same reason. Why would you go somewhere at 2am with a chance of overcrowding and being filmed, when you can go somewhere where you can dance till 6am, albeit only 60% of the fun?
I remember people at that time complaining that it was bullshit the DJ wasn't behind a curtain like the good ol days. Even being able to see the DJ made the party too much like a rock concert and "it was ruining the scene"
There was a whole era of conversation like this that was against spinning compact discs and cdjs. A real DJ spins vinyl. CDs sound too cold and sterile and they are "ruining the scene".
When people started spinning mp3s? lol, that was apocalyptic and totally "ruining the scene".
20 years from now there will be something new "ruining the scene" unlike the good old days when people put a lot of effort into their outfit and crafted videos to post on tiktok to try to promote "the scene".
Partygoers with cameras reduce this relationship to simple consumerism, largely consumption of content. The more passive attendees there are, the larger the pressure is on the venue to make or break the party. Tiktok ravers are just more egregious iteration of the thing.
But yeah, we definitely complained about instagram a decade ago as well. Maybe we are getting old!
Just saying, destroyed? Come on.
I linked two short documentaries in another comment, but basically:
tik tok kids don't adhere to safer drug use at all. Outfits and photos are not the worst thing. Overdoses are on a high. At the same time, looking out for each other is not something they tend to do. Especially at "illegal" raves, we have a very big problem of Gen Z not helping folks who feel unwell, leading to people dying on the floor. This is not a "the new generation is shit" argument. I despise tik tok ravers, not the gen z per se.
> There is a huge difference as well for lgbtq people at these places, the inclusivity has dramatically improved.
I don't understand where you're coming from. In Germany this was never a problem. Nobody gave a shit who you are and how you're dressed.
That is the total opposite to what is happening in German clubs
Otherwise it’s a coin flip unless you’re clearly intoxicated, belligerent, etc.
Same as it ever was. You just didn’t recognize it because you were younger and in clubland youth is the only status currency that’s zero effort to acquire.
you guys can act nostalgic about $5 cover charges at farmhouses in the middle of the woods, but that stuff was objectively horrible. smoke filled, counterculture only people, dingy.
I love the crowd that comes to these $600 music festivals, they're sexy and maintain good jobs or wealth, good support systems, can talk deeply about many technical topics, second hand smoke is sparse, and the production value increased to match!
oh no, phones. like what? this didn't start post pandemic. you have a missing decade and I'm not even going to ask.
edit: saw some of your other comments on this topic, this category of person is a big matter of discussion in Germany it seems. I think its silly to just put Tik Tok as an adjective on everything you don't like because I see that in other fields too. There are certain behaviors it seems some people are doing that are different than the ones you highlighted.
> I think its silly to just put Tik Tok as an adjective on everything you don't like because I see that in other fields too. There are certain behaviors it seems some people are doing that are different than the ones you highlighted.
Well, I do because it's the only thing I can say something about. It's not a category I put on everyone I don't like but it's a term that's shared and quite clearly defined in a very narrow discussion about techno and the pandemic. It only partially relates to the overall tik tok consumerism discussion.
In London we have some excellent clubs that don't care whatsoever about what you're wearing and everybody has a great time. You buy a ticket, you get in, simple as that.
Berghain is very elitist in this regard. There exist lots of other clubs in Berlin.
Berghain is one of the most famous clubs in the world. It has and cultivates an underground image, which is why people want to go there in the first place. You don't need a "uniform", on the contrary, individualism is what will get you in without problems. Just don't be an obvious tourist who just wants to tick a box for their Berlin visit.
>You don't need a "uniform",
Everybody says you need to wear black. Even the tourists have wisened up to that.
That is false.
Look, if you just made it for everybody, it would no longer be a club with an underground image. Berghain is a tourist magnet because it simply is an unbelievable location straight out of a Mad Max movie, paired with a Funktion-One sound system that fits your head like a headphone, featuring the best techno DJs in the world, and you can spend your whole weekend there without ever leaving the club. They surely do not struggle financially, on the contrary, the owners are probably swimming in money and only still do it because it's fun.
Besides, let me say there's lots of other clubs in Berlin you can go to. The article is correct that there used to be much, much more, but the main issue for clubs is not attendance, but like pretty much in every big city: rising rent and neighbors who complain about noise and garbage.
It is clearly not underground because everybody knows about it. It only achieves the "image" through arbitrary discrimination. That is the least punk as you can get.
None of what you said makes Berghain great goes away by letting more people experience it. The sound system and DJs will still be there.
I guarantee if Berghain stopped trying to be techno Mecca, the riff raff would lose interest, and you wouldn't need the picky bouncers. There's a particular club I go to in London that this works perfectly well for.
In my experience there is no "right way to look" when going to Berghain, most people online have no idea what the club actually is and just keep repeating the same old tired clichees - like the fantasy that you have to be dressed all black or something to get in.
In my experience the bouncer just sees if you will have a good time at the party or not. And that is what they select on. Once you worked some years at a club door you can see instantly who should get in and who shouldn't. Clothing is an indicator but its not the important one. Its about the look in your eyes.
that sounds so lame tbh. i thought most people left behind this social scarcity shit after sixth form.
Almost like actual adults who still sport non-drug-addled brains should run away as quickly as possible.
It does not have anything to do with magical thinking or beliefs, its years of experience and a deep understanding of the culture and clientele that visits your venue.
Of course you don't have to participate if you don't like it, there are plenty of clubs (in Berlin too) where you just pay entry and thats it.
And thats fine! I do too. But to claim it's impossible just because we are not good at it would be absurd.
It’s really a great example of the narcissistic desire for power and control that drives the behavior of a lot of people in the scene.
And yes, it is possible to quickly assess someones P(an issue) after a career of observing tens of thousands of people and whether or not they were an issue.
These things can both be true.
[And keep in mind a false-positive matters not-one-bit-at-all, whereas a false-negative is (quite literally) an issue.]
We're supposed to believe they're engaged in some sort of vibe curation process to attain the perfect crowd for the night. There's this weird purity aspect to it that is more than a little problematic.
It is the fool that tells the industry-proven expert that they know better.
It's amazing brand strategy but that doesn't mean it actually is the best thing going, of course.
I trust the Berliners I know (and those who have posted here with similar opinions) who don't view it quite so favorably. From them I hear it's a very good club but usually not worth the hassle of the lines and the arbitrary door policy.
This rings true with my own experience as someone who has been to Berghain multiple times over the years - I've never had a bad time, but it's gone downhill, and other Berlin clubs offer equivalent or better experiences without the annoying exclusivity.
From what I see a lot of people have these desires but rarely act on them. People often tell me in confidence when I mention what I do.
I think it's a lot more normative than people think.
Punk isn't punk anymore. When Google & other major corporations espouse the same core tenets of inclusivity, you're not rejecting or rebelling against anything. Perhaps Berghain and other exclusive clubs do not care about a 'punk' identity.
Beyond the outfit you are also most likely to get in if you are clearly bringing your personal uniqueness and energy to the place rather than expecting an experience, and if you show respect for the culture, everyone else present, and that you are able to handle something out of the ordinary.
Are you gonna have a good time in there and not ruin anyone else's time? You'll get in.
The culture in Berghain (and many Berlin clubs) is amazing - and part of the reason is the selectivity!
There is absolutely nothing underground about Berghain and that fake ass techno revival, not since the last 15 years.
Not true. I have never seen or heard anything like this to happen at the Berghain queue.
This in incredibly ironic. What if I like wearimg denim jeans, a smart shirt and brown shoes? That'll be considered not individualist enough and I won't get in?
It would make the scene’s champagne Marxism just a little too obvious for comfort.
It has nothing to do with his vibe. A non-celebrity ultra high net worth individual would get the red carpet treatment. Berghain guestlist isn’t at all hard to get.
That's literally all they're known for. It's their whole business model. "Don't come because you probably won't get in" -> everyone tries to get in
Outside of Central London things quickly get more reasonable.
I'm not sure this guy could be more pretentious if he tried. Maybe they should consider that this kind of attitude might be part of the problem.
Berlin has elevated snobbism to an art form.
I was there recently and the city felt much more subdued. Things got cleaned up. Lots of new housing. A bit more gentrified and quiet.
I’m guessing the crowds aged out.
If that's how the nightclub business works, it's better for the government to stay away from subsidizing them. Let them run their business in their own way - but without taxpayer funding.
The truth is that those clubs are more elitist than the opera house.
And on the weekends when the divas are not singing, you can see Khruangbin ...
Most operagoers are adults, but that's about it.
I’ve been there a million times and even one person who doesn’t know techno and the way our scene works can ruin a few dozen square meters of dancefloor with boorish leering.
If you want to party in a sea of drunken tourists because they let everyone in, there are plenty of other clubs that aren’t nearly as protective of their dance floor vibe. Berghain is the exception, not the rule.
For a while the pretext was "neighbors are complaining about noise", but that got yanked by new regulations (i.e. making clubs "places of high culture" so they can't be attacked easily).
Now it's about declining revenue, yet clubs are still full. What will be next?
If they let in everyone who wants to go, it would stop being the thing that it is (which is why it is valuable and sought after). People don’t go there only for the building and sound system (though both are top notch). It’s the experience enabled by the specific people who are there (and, perhaps more importantly, who are not).
Many people check in all of their clothing at coat check. You can have gay or straight sex in most parts of the club. I’ve been involved in BDSM scenes in different parts of the venue. Nobody leers, nobody harasses you. There aren’t generally people wasted drunk, there are no fights.
If it were not a microcosm containing the specific scene it exists to support, and they just let in the general public indiscriminately, it would be no different than drinking in the park. Anyone can buy a world class soundsystem and book fancy techno DJs. Not anyone can recreate Berghain.
> Even Berghain, typically an anomaly because it draws crowds from around the world, has raised its cover charge to deal with rising costs. He thinks fewer Europeans are making quick clubbing trips to the city due to the financial hit of the pandemic.
As a student, I had time and patience to look for another club for being denied entrance because I wasn't wearing leather BDSM harnesses after waiting in line for 2 hours. Now not so much.
This is good news though, now that the economic pressure is on, maybe it's a good time for non-fashionistas to go raving in Berlin again, though I doubt the euro is stronger than scene snobism.
As someone who isn't white I can't stand clubs and the thought of being rejected because of how I look. It happened to me 90% of the time when I was young trying to enter these clubs, so new I just go to shows where I pre-paid my tickets. I haven't stepped foot in a club for years. The racism at the door of these prestigious clubs is/was simply insane.
On the grand scheme, this is pretty normal in Berlin and to every club scene. Pretty much every club I raved in during Berlin's techno heydays in the 90th has been closed or demolished, same goes for Frankfurt (Dorian Gray, Omen, XS, Easy, Oxo, Fun, Paramount Park, only Palazzo is somewhat still there). Even Loveparade "died", Mayday is still alive, but the theme has changed.
The mentioned Tik Tok ravers where previously known as "BRAVO ravers". Veterans from Germany will understand the reference.
Times are changing, so are clubs. Every generation bemoans the loss of its heritage. So maybe this is the essence: every generation has to take care of their club landscape.
And maybe sounding a bit arrogant, if you consider these days club scene "famed", then the anarchic club scene from the 90th must be considered a world heritage for comparison, since they set the trends for all generations to follow in a much larger picture.
Greetings to the 90th. ;)
It's a moderation problem, and if you don't have the right "vibes" you don't get in.
It's arbitrary? Yes. Prone to false positives? Yes. Does it work? Also yes.
That's how clubs maintain their unique identity.
I used to resent the door policies but after this experience (it really destroyed the atmosphere!), I am glad they exist.
Oh god, the horror. How did you cope? Did you still manage to express yourself with these soul sucking chino wearers nearby? It's a good thing that indiviualism is so non-judgemental huh.
And paying to get into places where you couldn't get otherwise (by "vibes" only) is enough to tell you're out of place.
Elon Musk tried to enter Berghain and was refused; Kanye West tried to jump the line at Mustafa and was sent back.
It has been interesting to grow up with clubbing and see it go from an underground youth subculture that seemed to radically reinvent itself every year to a crowd of the same people but now middle-aged. I wonder if this is what happened to people who kept going to 80s nights, or if people in their teens and 20s just don't "go out" in the same way any more.
So just like the grunge nights, northern soul all-nighters, lindy-hops and penny socials before them, a cultural form of creative destruction will see this too fade into history to be replaced by whatever expression the new generation finds to express their situation, which is different in every way to the world that birthed Berghain.
Society has aged and there are just fewer youths now. The millennial population boom let everyone ignore this reality for a few years.
And the youths who remain don’t have nearly as much time for clubbing; it hasn’t exactly become easier to get started in life lately. Not to mention that many zoomers who do go to clubs tend to loathe exclusivity so they wouldn’t even consider Berghain.
But the Berlin club scene long predates millennials and is not going anywhere.
People constantly discussing being molested, being shamed for openly expressing themselves, etc. The vibes are off now. It's very interesting as a casual observer, but I imagine it's extremely sad for those who were dependent on it.
I've also heard way too many GHB horror stories recently.
Night clubs now collude to make their own staff and those few select DJs money and fame, without introducing new and unaffiliated talent into the mix. They extort free labor out of unknown DJs and artists under the illusion that it is a big honor to play for free at a "prestigious" nightclub, while only the club is the one making profit, and clubs usually make a lot of profit at that.
Now they wonder why the model is failing after years of creating a deeply controlled circle of exclusivity. Money is funneled out of the music community to various other interests, and clubs rarely do anything to build communities that support and elevate their local music cultures. It's hard to feel sorry for a closed system like that failing. :/
Berghain has become kind of a tourist stunt. Visitors don't know any other clubs and they read about it online. So, they show up and try to get in just so they can say they got in. They get turned away and you see all the accusations of elitism, racism, etc.
I said “predominantly” it’s for the young, not “just” for the young. As people age they tend to have greater demands on their time, they have on-average lower energy levels, they’re more likely to have injuries or mobility problems, they trend away from pursuing instant gratification, they trend towards earlier bedtimes and earlier waking, etc. Not everyone follows all of those trends to the same degree or at the same ages but the trends are real and they systematically whittle away at the older crowd participation rates in active/sensual pursuits. Any such pursuits in a rapidly aging society will wither commensurately.
At least from my experience, they tend to be a lot more fun. Clubs tend to be too much about showing off to my taste.
There's at least a degree of resistance towards letting in too much of the American ethos, or at least in trying to make sure that the American tourist trying to get into the club is capable of hanging and respecting the hedonism within, as opposed to going balls to the wall for the sake of going balls to the wall.
If young people are not compelled to go to clubs these venues they might have to wait out for the next generation and a potential culture change.
Honestly I’m surprised how that business model has been so effective this far, I guess people do love the feeling of exclusivity from making the cut
(Having said that, while having what was supposed to be my last drink of the entire trip on my last night, I met an Austrian guy who told me about some club in walking distance he swore was good, so we went and it in fact was so good I missed my flight the next day, so it's not all clubs that are raging dickbags to would-be customers at the door, the exceptions are just hard to find.)
Next time try to enjoy the music and don't worry so much about what other people around you are up to!
In the past it would occur naturally, because electronic music was a niche thing. With raising popularity, door policies had to be implemented to maintain this community. Now that it's mainstream, clueless outsiders start coming in telling people who built the scene what to do.
Quite similar to what happened to tech and the Internet in fact. The club scene is in its Eternal September now.
There will be ups and downs, smiles and frowns
Share with me fairy tales or make-believe
There will be ups and downs, smiles and frowns
Share with me fairy tales or make-believe
There will be ups and downs, smiles and frowns
Share with me fairy tales or make-believe
- Snoop Dogg
What other to expect?
But such is life I guess.
Where did you get this from? Its more the generation that started clubbing is now all grown up, complains about the noise, and drives up property prices.