I Can Hear You Fine. Is It Rude That I'm Still Wearing AirPods? | Hacker News Reader

I Can Hear You Fine. Is It Rude That I'm Still Wearing AirPods?

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9 pointsgnicholas35 comments

There’s an additional factor to this that the “leaving your AirPods in when talking to someone is rude” crowd don’t realize: AirPods are actually very effective hearing aids. (https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/11/study-airpods-pro-ar...)

This is how I use them. I have moderate hearing impairment and a modest budget, and have been hesitant to plunk down thousands of dollars for decent hearing aids. When I realized the $250 earphones I already had were really good hearing aids, and figured out how to set them up that way, it was life-transforming.

I do try to take a minute to explain to people that my AirPods help me to hear, when I think about it. But if you suffer from stuffy judgments that people who wear AirPods are inconsiderate a-holes, you might want to think twice about that.

Yes, because not only does it look stupid that you have these things constantly hanging from your ears, but I have no way of knowing if you're listening to me or to the disembodied voice in your head.

Take them out and show proper focus and attention. Act the same way you'd expect others to act if you had something to say to them.

> I have no way of knowing if you're listening to me or to the disembodied voice in your head

People in conversation offer various cues, from eye contact and verbal responses to gestures and body language.

> show proper focus and attention

This sounds more like respect the old ways.

To be clear, I don’t keep my AirPods in when speaking. But I’m cautious about instinctive moralisation when it comes to customs and norms.

What you seem to miss out on is the same people that leave their ear dangles in also don't offer those social queues and the ones they do offer are ambiguous. You really have no way if knowing if they're listening and responding to you or to the thing plugged in to their head.

This is not a take your hat off indoors kind of thing which would be a societal custom. This is a do I know if we are communicating and do I have your focus thing.

You seemed to have missed out on the part of showing the same level of attention that they would expect if they initiated the conversation. That's a big miss on your part because there the core issue of the over developed sense of entitlement. Because no one says, oh yeah it's fine if I have no idea if you're listening to me or not. No we all get irritated. So just do what you'd expect if the situation was reversed. That's not cultural custom specific thing. That's a society thing.

> What you seem to miss out on is the same people that leave their ear dangles in also don't offer those social queues and the ones they do offer are ambiguous.

I've noticed this as well. Maybe I wouldn't feel so uncomfortable trying to talk to people wearing them if they gave the same cues people who aren't wearing them give -- but I can't remember ever seeing that happen.

>What you seem to miss out on is the same people that leave their ear dangles in also don't offer those social queues and the ones they do offer are ambiguous.

Did you ever consider that they're not offering those social cues because they're not interested in what you have to say? You sound like you're having a one-sided conversation with a wall and then getting mad that the wall isn't paying you the "proper" respect. I have never been unsure of whether someone was listening to me with AirPods. If I was, I'd ask them and would know immediately or else I wouldn't waste my time. Not everyone has to hear what you have to say.

The way it usually goes is I tell them something, they pretend to hear or act like they don't care. Then later when they missed that piece of information and missed out on something they complain that I didn't tell them.

If they don't care what I have to say that's fine but don't complain when they miss out. That's the crux with your argument. They always complain when they miss out. It's that over developed self entitlement thing. Only they matter so only they matter so they don't want to listen, only they matter so it's my fault when they miss out.

You seem be this exact person. Because what you think is me being angry because they didn't listen is totally wrong. I could care less if someone doesn't listen. What I get upset about is being burdened with the responsibility of someone else not listening. Shut your hole about the results of not listening and be responsible for your self absorbed arrogance that no one has value but yourself and everything will be fine. Sulk in the corner that you missed out.

Apparently responding with "you" to a comment that used "you" is inappropriate. I guess I'll put my air pods in now.

This is not an appropriate way to communicate with people on this site.

You sound like you have difficulties with harboring resentment, and projecting your experiences onto strangers. The tone in all of your comments is hostile, lacking benefit of the doubt, generalizing and presumptive.

Quite frankly, if you typically act this way in person, I'd probably zone out when you spoke as well. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that maybe there is a person in your life with listening problems, but a) OP is not "this exact person", that's projection, and b) you possibly have your own communication issues, based on this thread.

Regardless, you will have a much more pleasant time in life if you learn to be more accepting. I wear my airpods chronically, and no one has ever questioned if I was listening to them, because I have active listening skills. The thought of an internet stranger having a problem with this is amusing.

I've never seen or heard anyone who wears AirPods complain that they missed a part of a conversation they cared about. I think you're just lying now.

>Shut your hole about the results of not listening and be responsible for your self absorbed arrogance that no one has value but yourself and everything will be fine. Sulk in the corner that you missed out.

Also, yeah... you're totally not angry and entitled... it's totally everyone else...

> do I know if we are communicating and do I have your focus thing.

I have friends who keep their AirPods in. I've literally never had this problem. Might it be that there are cues they're sending that you aren't picking up? Or that the issue of AirPods being in or out is not causing the lack of attentiveness transmission. (I can empathize with what you describe, but most commonly because someone can't get their face out of their phone or watch.)

I get that we associate focus and attention with not having anything in our ears. But consider that many people, myself included, will wear AirPods in noisy environments, because the Conversation Boost feature makes it possible to hear speech more clearly.

In understand that, and it's a valid reason but likely the minority of uses. It bothers me quite a lot that the is such a stigma around hearing aids. Those fake Bluetooth earpiece things were the start of it. That is a social problem where we see hearing aids and associate old abd weak with it. I'm not saying that why you use it, by I do personally know others who use those devices so they look more "youthful".

I think anyone who's going to wear them needs to have extra focus on those around who might be trying to communicate. Or maybe they need an "I'm not listening" light so we know who not to talk to.

Agreed that the stigma is unnecessary and likely stops many people from getting the support they might find helpful.

In my case the hearing damage is not sufficient to warrant a hearing aid, but it’s also enough to make it hard to understand conversation when there’s background noise. I don’t have the numbers on this but I’d assume there are a lot more people like me, who benefit from added clarity in specific situations, who would not need or even qualify for an actual hearing aid. In those cases a device you already have and use in other context hands down wins over a specialised medical device.

Elmer Fudd yells at cloud. More at 11.

This sounds like a generational gap. I'm with the youngsters on this one. If you can't tell if someone is engaging with you then why are you in the conversation to begin with? No one is forcing you to engage with people wearing AirPods and if you feel like they're not listening to you or showing "proper" focus (whatever that is), then leave. In other words, act the same way you would expect others to act if you were wearing AirPods and not listening to them.

If it's a generational gap it has nothing to do with thinking people must listen to me. It's about simply being a polite human. I know that's difficult for some people. Because the results are always the same. The people who don't care to listen because their self entitlement is so strong they can't comprehend others actually exist as well, they'll complain that "I wasn't told" When it's really you didn't listen.

"Hey, we're buying pizza for lunch. What kind do you want"

...

"Hey the pizza is here"

...

(Some time later) "Why did no one tell me about the pizza, it's all gone now" (continues the bitching about missing out for the rest of the day)

That's the problem with that attitude you're displaying. You think you're so important no one has anything if value to say, but then you don't accept the responsibility for your self absorbed attitude.

The fact that you don't see it is prime evidence of the problem. If you're living in your own world then live in it. Because you're also missing my comment that they themselves wouldn't want to be treated this way. Don't try and have it both ways that no one can talk to you, but others must listen to you.

>Don't try and have it both ways that no one can talk to you, but others must listen to you.

I never said that and, frankly, based on the way you're responding elsewhere, I don't believe anything that you're saying. If it bothers you so much that this person is complaining about the pizza, maybe point out that they didn't hear it because of their AirPods (although I'm pretty sure this didn't happen). I work with a multi-generational team and we've never had this problem so, to me, it seems like you're the entitled, insufferable one and people don't listen to you. Sometimes, that means they miss out on pizza. Most of the time, they're probably missing out on condescension, resentment, and whatever other insufferable things you have to say.

Ugh. You’re one of those types that demand performative efforts and strict conformity. These things are actively harmful in so many ways. Consider the fact that people can hear you perfectly fine with them in and your opinion of their appearance is something you should keep to yourself as it is only marginally less offensive than asking women to smile.

Sorry, I was checking smartphone. Could you repeat that?

I actually find that using them in 'transparency mode' kind of amplifies the sound a bit, and makes it easier for me to hear people speaking. Easier than if I'd not been wearing them at all. I have terrible hearing, so the little bit extra actually helps a lot!

I have wondered about how this will evolve. There are accessibility settings that allow you to specify the frequencies where you hear better and worse, which could make this effect even stronger for people who have hearing loss in particular ranges. And given how expensive hearing aids are (both up-front, and for the batteries), I could see some people using AirPods as a cheaper alternative.

You should look into the Conversation Boost if you haven’t already. Has given me the ability to socialise in noisy environments

You can tune the sound to accommodate your specific hearing loss with an audiogram! It’s very quick: https://kottke.org/23/04/customize-your-airpods-pro-for-even...

I don't know if it's rude or not, but it does very effectively discourage me from talking to people while they're wearing them.

I Can Hear You Fine. Is It Rude That I'm Still Scrolling My Facebook / texting my friends?

I had this crazy experience this weekend where a grown person abruptly stopped mid conversation after glancing at their Apple Watch to reply to an email on their phone. They did apologize after the fact but it was jarring nonetheless.

I silently leave when this happens. They are so engrossed with the phone they won't notice your gone until they look up and you pulled a Batman.

Did it twice on dates. Turns a frustrating experience into a hilarious one.

Same goes for sunglasses. I have a really diffcult time talking to someone without seeing thier eyes. Not beeing sure if thier attention is on me or somewhere else is really strange.

Yes it's rude, and yes AirPods look distractingly stupid sticking out of people's heads, but what's most important here is that we preserve the social cue that someone wearing headphones does not want to talk.

Putting on a pair of headphones/inserting earbuds is a very useful means of saying that I'm busy with/focused on something else or simply do not want to be disturbed. There aren't many other discreet/polite "Leave me alone" signals out there. Please don't ruin this for us.

I had a Fossil hybrid smartwatch, which looked very much like a regular analog watch. A funny thing happened when I would glance down at it to check a notification — people didn't realize it was a smartwatch, and thought I was pressed for time. This never happened when I had a more smart-looking smartwatch — people always understood I was checking a notification (and didn't mind).

I think that, over time, people will become accustomed to the fact that AirPods have conversational awareness, and you can carry on conversations like normal (and in the case of some hearing-impaired folks, better-than-normal) while wearing them.

It will take some time, and will catch on sooner in some circles than others. But I'd be surprised if in 5 years this weren't widely understood in many circles — especially those HNers run in. I hope I'll still have the courtesy to take my earbud out, though!

I think this is the most accurate response here. It'll become more commonplace as people realize that it improves conversations to use that mode just like having a smart-watch improved most people's lives enough to wear that it's now accepted.

Yes.

I tried the conversation awareness mode on my AirPods and turned it off after a couple days. I prefer to just wear one earbud so that I can hear out of the other ear normally.

No, I think it's fine and honestly I can understand the need to compulsively use AirPods especially among the anxiety prone. Forcing people to endure the noise of the world, which is increasingly inorganic and terrifying, just because you insist on them listening to you in a subservient manner, is very strange and the sort of insistence I would expect only from narcissists. I personally wear my AirPods Pro at all times when in public because it makes it that much easier to tolerate it. I have transparency mode on so I can still listen to you, probably better than without AirPods.

If the person is listening to you and responding just fine, then the AirPods are not a problem. If the person is obviously distracted then you have cause to ask them to take them off. Simple as.

Yes.

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