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Comment by omginternets | Hacker News Reader

How on earth is it street legal to emit a high-pressure plume of jet exhaust behind you?

We live in a society where things are legal by default. Why would adding a jet engine to a car be a priori illegal? If he harms somebody or otherwise causes damage, that itself is what's illegal and he'd be liable regardless of motor vehicle regulations. If this mod became a larger trend, especially consumer-available, then regulations would be implemented to head it off. But for a few lone instances it's not particularly necessary.

I am not in the US, but where i am afaik anything that modifies the car like this would have to go through some sort of recertification process.

It would be perfectly legal on private property but not public roads

Well not sure where you are, but where in EU I am, you can modify the insides of your car (people attach entire apartments to the insides of their cars...), and there's nothing wrong about stuff sticking outside - you just need to attach a red flag if it's over 1.5m out of the car (maybe red flame would be enough?).

The modified rear door might be a problem, but where I am you could simply keep the original open, or detach it.

Road traffic laws are absolutely not harmonized across the EU.

French, Portuguese and German rules of the road for example are all different in statutory strictness and enforcement strictness.

I’d guess that’s true in the US too, if you modify the engine or transmission or exhaust system, etc. But adding something to your car without modifying the existing systems has no regulation and no certification process, which he sorta talks about in the article re: police inability to enforce. As long as there aren’t other laws you violate, hanging a big fan out the window might not count as modifying the car.

20 years ago in Australia my car got canaried because I had LPG and a pod filter, which was illegal because you were only allowed 1 modification to the intake system. I am 100% confident that if I strapped a jet to the car, it would be illegal. As it should be. If you want to do extremely dangerous modifications, do it on your own property. Not a public road where you risk killing a family of 5.

You're speaking from an Australian perspective about what is, to make an otherwise unsupported argument about what should be in the US. I'll be one of the first to point out problems and blindspots from the American conception of "freedom", but in this case it seems highly appropriate. You yourself even got bit by overregulation for something seemingly reasonable and forward-looking, and yet you're still reflexively defending it!

In my estimation your example "family of 5" is at much more risk from widespread unnecessarily-high bro-dozer trucks than a single engineer personally adding a jet engine to his car while seemingly being very in touch with the dangers of operating it. In fact given the severe disparity in other vehicle crash survivability statistics between coupes and trucks, I've got to wonder if this car isn't still individually safer than a casually-driven pickup truck.

As an Australian-American living in the US I can confirm that the Australian concept of law (aka Nanny State) would ensure that this modification is illegal by default. Think of the children.

Children don't really fit in the intake so it shouldn't be a problem

I was shocked as a Brit American living in the US how nanny state Aust is. Even more than Britain. Certainly when it comes to cars and driving. The whole ‘anti hoon’ thing seems shocking to me with my now mostly American sensibilities.

But I guess that’s why we both live here rather than blighty or down under.

Australia's just fine with adding jet engines to cars and designing|building one million round per minute guns.

It's the mixing up of such things with the general unconsenting public that raises an eyebrow.

Hoon's can hoon - just out of earshot of people that want a quiet life and off the community car parks and roadways - there's no shortage of private land and designated drag strips | raceways.

https://aussieinvader.com/the-people/rosco-mcglashan-oam/

https://thewest.com.au/lifestyle/motoring/wa-built-1600kmh-j...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_Storm

It’s important to understand most things happen for a reason, and as a Brit American living in the US you might be missing some context.

In the area I grew up, it was expected that your first car would be a V8. Hooning was ingrained into the culture. Back then it was a single spinner, no ABS, no airbags, basically no safety features at all. So what would happen is someone would get their licence, grab as many mates as they could, drive as fast as they could, and wrap their car around a tree killing everyone. Every week there was a news story about a multiple fatality P plate accident caused by hooning.

A culture of dangerous driving and dangerous vehicles led to Australia’s anti-hoon laws. It’s not just “ooh silly nanny state laws for no reason”.

It is likely to be safer simply because the one driving it is going to be a lot more careful than the average driver.

I recall seeing a study a while ago that showed how those who work on their own cars, especially for those who do major jobs like engine rebuilds, are statistically far less likely to get into an accident. Unfortunately I can't find it now.

> a single engineer personally adding a jet engine to his car while seemingly being very in touch with the dangers of operating it

What if a non-engineer who doesn’t understand the dangers makes this type of modification? This is is why it needs to be illegal. Just because someone straps a jet engine to their car it doesn’t mean they know what they’re doing, and _that_ is the risk, and why pretty much all laws exist in the first place. Many people could drive safely without speed limits, but we have speed limits to cater for people who can’t. My point is that if this type of modification truly is legal in America, that’s scary, and Australia got the laws right. A jet-powered car is not inherently safer in the US than Australia.

> What if a non-engineer who doesn’t understand the dangers makes this type of modification?

This hasn’t happened afaik in the last 15 years. I assume any non-engineer who doesn’t know the dangers also doesn’t have the technical know how to build this. Also the cost is several hundred thousand $.

History seems to indicate it’s a non-issue.

He didn't modify the car's original factory system. He simply added onto it, he added a second independent system.

Tbh I kinda agree this is a bit ridiculous to assume it's safe to drive on the road though.

In this case the law has already been written. It's not a CARB-approved, nor EPA compliant engine. You're not allowed to run it on the street. The law is written so that everything you do to a car's emission system is illegal by default. To make any engine modifications in California, the part must be CARB approved and have a compliance sticker on it. Engine swaps in California are legal, as long as the engine being swapped is at least as new as the engine in the vehicle and meets the same regulatory requirements. Which means you swap in another EPA/CARB approved engine, but not a jet engine.

The stock engine — and the emission control system attached to it — are entirely untouched.

In California, you have to register your car and have it pass a smog test. How would this pass that?

Just drive on the gasoline engine.

Doesn't the smog test require you to run your car at the peak power it can do, or something like that?

Floor the accelerator, yes.

Find a toggle for an unrelated afterburner? Not so much.

I’d hate to be the minimum wage tech tying to figure that out!

Aren't "inspections" nowadays done only by plugging into the OBD port? So, no problem?

Its street legal to drive using the standard motor with the jet engine OFF.

Oooh, it's a hybrid!

"Hmmm, the car has two engines making the car a hybrid so maybe we can drive in the commuter lanes along with the Toyota Priuses. "

Imagine being the cop who has to argue over the ticket with that guy ^^

"I'm... gonna park a little further back."

There's a paragraph and photo of this very thing in the TFA

> That doesn't stop me from the occasional blast on the highway though.

Something being road-illegal doesn't stop you from doing it anyways...

Jet exhaust doesn't need to be high pressure. It depends. For example a turboprop engine doesn't provide any jet thrust and usually the exhaust is even pointed away from the direction of flight.

But it is very hot so exhausting it close to the ground or people is a serious problem.

’Murica

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