Pentagon’s shameful effort to draft mentally disabled men to fight in Vietnam
taskandpurpose.com
taskandpurpose.com
In the end, it turned out that those of lower IQ would continue having less of a productive role in society--something that was already accelerating at the time. Perhaps that's the real tragedy here. We have an oversupply of those only capable of simple labor. Maybe trying more "x's Morons" ideas isn't such a bad idea?
If you read the detailed accounts of this program, it’s clear that it wasn’t some inclusivity exercise. They wanted cheap fodder. They really just got a lot of battlefield liability. We’re witnessing what a “soldier comes second” doctrine looks like in Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.
Of course I’m all for better support for the less mentally capable. But let’s not pretend that fighting in a war doesn’t require intelligence.
It really depends who's people.
is quantity vs quality doctrine
Modern warfare, especially that since World War 1 and the rise of deaths on the battlefront on a massive scale, requires a high amount of intelligence on all levels to be executed. You need generals who can envision new strategies such as the blitzkrieg or the paradrop. You need sergeants and master sergeants to provision and allocate adequate resources for your regiments. You need privates and conscripts to figure out where enemy mines are, or to follow orders from top to execute their complex maneuvers. Of course, you could also adopt ages-old Russian-style human steamroller doctrines and send in men after men to their deaths, just like the world did in WW1. We're already seeing that in Ukraine - 3 day operation is going strong after 500+ days.
> Maybe trying more "x's Morons" ideas isn't such a bad idea?
Perhaps the US government should enlist a number of upvoters of this comment, put them on the median national wage and force them to work for days on to refurbish creaking government IT systems? Just a thought, heh.
I feel like you're misrepresenting what the article is about. I'm pretty sure it's not the people whose IQ is a bit below 91 we're really talking about here. As the article states (emphasis mine):
> These men all had IQs below 91, and nearly half had IQs below 71.
What people find inhumane about this policy isn't "the army recruited a guy with an IQ of 87 from our town", but "the army recruited a guy with an IQ of 68 who can't read or write and has never heard of Vietnam from our town".
An IQ below 71 is typically labelled as a cognitive impairment, not only now, but then as well. These are people who are often considered unable to function independently in normal civilian life. The idea that, even with modern tech, a war environment is much simpler to navigate than civilian life, seems so obviously absurd to me that I have trouble even articulating an argument against it.
> Is it more moral for the inevitable sacrifices of warfare to be solely among a society's higher IQ individuals?
I object to your use of the term "inevitable". Sacrifices are inevitable during war, but the war itself wasn't inevitable. The moral thing would have been to end the war, rather than prolong a war that leadership knew damn well they were losing at this point.
The Pentagon immediately scrapped the draft following Vietnam and started recruiting from the trailer parks.
They're the ones that run the society, so I don't see why not.
I know it's trendy to perform amoral, sociopathic disregard for humanity (and geerally to post boundary-crossing provocations on the Internet). It's a very, very dangerous thing - which is probably why it's trendy; people like to play with those things, to look edgy. Our behaviors truly influence reality, as we know well now; the Internet is not a separate world, like a multi-player video game, but part of reality with direct impact. Also, not only does choosing that behavior introduce an enormous negative, but we feel the absence of the positive. If you and I don't do the latter, who will? There's no parents out there to fix what we break as we play. The world needs you.
"The FBI came and picked him up from our home, they gave him a vehicle, gave him a fake bomb, and every means to make this happen," the statement said, adding that authorities "should not have aided and abetted a paranoid schizophrenic to commit this act."
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/family-fbi-knew-oklahoma-bomb-p...
Putting people in that extreme situation without the mental and emotional capability is a nightmare of cruelty.
That's a big assumption, and I doubt it applies broadly: Many military jobs do not depend much on physical fitness: Drone pilot, mechanic, truck driver, radar operator. Front line service is only one small part.
Also, it omits the point that less-than-physically-fit can understand the risks, made their own decisions, and also improve their fitness.
Imagine drafting people with physical handicaps - that would be the equivalent of McNamara's horrible program.
I honestly have no idea how this thought leads to the conclusion that we need to lower the physical standards for military services, rather than simply disallow any woman who can’t meet them from serving in a combat role. We shouldn’t relax the standards to make it easier for women to join, we should be holding women to the exact same standard as anyone else.
If an individual can’t sling a wounded soldier over their shoulder and carry him, why are we allowing these people to enlist at all, regardless of sex? You can’t start accepting blind people into combat roles just to meet diversity quotas. If you can’t meet the basic standards of sight, you can’t enlist. If you can’t meet the basic physical standards, you can’t enlist. That just makes sense.
Army aptitude tests do not test IQ directly. They test general knowledge (like basic math), ability to follow directions, that sort of thing. IQ is not the only mental issue that makes you unsuitable.
So kinda, reliability of those tests is not really relevant.
Now with the press nothing more than a rumor mill, all abuses that are happening today may never see the light of day.
During the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, the abuses that were reported were ignored because no one cared. By then, no one had any trust in the US Gov. And now, many Local and National Governments can hide a lot due to a very weak press.
The press has always been, at best, a manicured presentation of events that, even at its best, is often hemmed in by external constraints. Some might say that the trashiness of today's press is a symptom of the erosion of elite control over an official narrative. Noise and sensationalism not only sell, but they can also function as distractions.
We don’t know yet how this will all turn out. Do we have faith in our fellows to sort through and find the good stuff, or do we assume they will mostly get sucked in by the best propaganda?
Of course we always assume that we can tell the difference.
There is a much higher volume of trash and a much higher percentage of trash, but it's still not hard to find the quality reporting. There are a lot of surveillance-infested messaging apps, but whether there are zero or 10,000 of them, it's just as easy to install Signal.
For news, there's the NY Times, Financial Times, Washington Post, ... PBS NewsHour is effing amazing. Also the AP, NBC/ABC/CBS, Reuters, AFP, BBC, etc. Who can read them all? I don't need to worry about the mountains of trash.
> Do we have faith in our fellows to sort through and find the good stuff, or do we assume they will mostly get sucked in by the best propaganda?
Well, I do have to worry about it because lots of people do get their news from trash (partly due to certain forces demonizing jouralism along with anything else that stands in their way), and their misinformation has an enormous affect on my life and the world. Misinformation is the primary cause of climate change, as an example - seriously: no misinfo, no climate change problem.
> Of course we always assume that we can tell the difference.
Yes, of course. The moment you start thinking that, you're the sucker, a walking talking mark. You, not me, that is. (just kidding)
> During the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, the abuses that were reported were ignored because no one cared. By then, no one had any trust in the US Gov.
I wouldn't say that no one cared, but do you have evidence of that explanation? I'd say the abuses were overlooked for multple reasons - people despaired, and especially the reactionary segment of society was (and is) opposed to anything put forward by 'liberals', no matter what it is.
> with the press nothing more than a rumor mill
Try the NY Times, Financial Times, etc. Their articles are very well-researched, based on going in-person to the events (including the front line of war), talking to large numbers of the actual people involved - the actual witnesses, reading confidential documents, etc. One way to think of it: If someone wrote a blog post like that, you'd be amazed.
The urban rich and well off children could avoid the war (college and all), where rural areas not so much, born and work on a farm, off to Vietnam. Thus a divide started to happen :)
>Try the NY Times, Financial Times, etc
Yes for national news, but in many areas there is no local news, so Town, City pols, in theory, can hide a lot.
I only had to read up to the 3rd sentence :
"Ehh, he’s one of McNamara’s Morons.”
This "project" allowed 354,000 to serve. 5,478 casualties of those. 1.5% casualty rate.
> Project 100,000 soldiers saw combat at a rate nearly twice as high as other soldiers and were killed at a rate three times as high.
Army is able to absorb people of different races or gays and learned how to deal with gender. That does not imply it is, as an institution, capable to absorb handicapped people.
Right. The former issues do not affect performance, nor is it inhumanity to use them as soldiers. The latter does and is.
Just do an aptitude test when you join. Send the genius's to the R&D team. Send the good leaders to the officer training program. Send the good drivers to be tank drivers. etc.
Aptitude test exist for both enlisted and future officers. However, once you passed the test and are on your position, you all need to be alike.