Superbatteries will transform the performance of EVs
economist.com
economist.com
I think that eventually one of these solid state battery technologies will work out and also will be able to be manufactured reasonably cheaply. It seems very likely that manufacturing existing EV models will be pretty easily convertible to use whatever new battery technology shows up on the market (changing out the skateboard perhaps - not nothing to change but not that hard). Toyota says they have it figured out but their new EVs aren't coming until 2028 model year (5 years!). But this kind of longer timeline also hides the failure of a lot of car makers to invest enough in the battery supply chain - they can't buy enough batteries or they are too expensive, so it's another excuse for what they want anyway, which is not to make that many EVs. They want to keep selling ICE cars while they can.
Look at GM and Ford, the GM ultium battery pack has unspecified problems with mass manufacturing, Ford has also slowed down manufacturing at times this cal year (to improve efficiency or something, specific reasons unclear). I still see the market dynamics being that (1) Tesla continues to take market share from legacy auto where ever they are on the market, and (2) Chinese companies will follow and be even more devastating, because they are making EVs in even larger quantities, decent quality and low prices.
10 years ago, $30k bought you a Nissan Leaf with 80 miles of range.
Fast forward to today, and the same not-inflation-adjusted amount of money buys you a Chevy Bolt with around 240 miles of range.
I expect that within the next 10 years, a vehicle with the average new MSRP will get 400-500 miles of range on a charge. Even if that prediction doesn't pan out, we can almost guarantee that typical charging speeds will increase and charging networks will expand further, blowing past critical mass.
The weight means cornering isn’t great. The vehicle only weighs 3133 lbs and ~ 800lbs of that is battery.
So, if you want something sportier with decent range, then you have to build something more efficient. I think battery weights have improved a bit since it was built, but not by much.
What I said about “sportiness” doesn’t apply to 0-60 mph times, but those are already uncomfortably brutal in high-end EVs. Show me how it performs on a winding road!
I have to wonder if HN existed back in the early 1900s this discussion would be about how driving a car could never match the depth of the bond between horse and rider.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Roadster_(first_genera...
Weight: 2877 lbs Range: 244 mi
I agree putting the biggest battery you can in a car isn’t the right approach. It would be nice if people could experience an EV with a range like yours to calm their nerves.
Since it's the September before 2024, that's exactly 4 years.
The difference between you and me is that I see it as a sign that we need to move on from conventional batteries. BEVs are not the answer. We should stop talking about Tesla or whomever disrupting the car industry, because in the end what advantages do they actually have? There appears to be none, and frankly they have more disadvantages than anything else.
I can't go back to being a gashole.
In four or five years, I suspect that what we call "modern" batteries today will look as quaint and ancient to us as the ones that Volta was first playing around with in 1799.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1OEbKBNQDtw&pp=ygUcbmlvIGVzNiB...
Technical paper: [3]
2019 Nobel Prize in chemistry awarded to founder.[4]
When the idea has both a Nobel Prize and a product available right now from WalMart, it might actually work.
[2] https://www.walmart.com/search?q=Yoshino+Technology%2C+Inc.&....
[3] https://www.osti.gov/servlets/purl/1774194
[4] https://www.nobelprize.org/prizes/chemistry/2019/summary/
I get a high "using a non existing but near the horizon technology and stuffing it with existing Li cells" vibe from the website.
The company address, 18529 East Gale Ave City of Industry, CA 91748, US, is a warehouse. They're not manufacturing there. They left the overhead door open and Google Earth shows the inside. It's all cartons and pallets.
If you’re looking to tow a horse float long distances, or drive the Canning Stock Route[1] for fun, sure, current EVs are not going to meet your needs and things like solid state batteries will be helpful.
But this idea that current EV battery technology is somehow inadequate for most people is wrong and annoying.
Every time I do the calcs it takes more than ten years for the extra cost of an EV over a roughly equivalent ICEV to be recouped in my situation (which admittedly is fairly low mileage). And that's assuming tyre costs are the same, which I doubt for a heavier vehicle, and other maintenance costs (steering, brakes, suspension, body, lights and accessories, and interior) are zero for the EV.
Listen, I’m as radical as any of them, especially when it comes to the climate, but you can’t propose no new vehicles be produced and be taken seriously. We need outputs -governed regulation around CO2 And we need it now. Stopping vehicle production is a band aid over the symptom, not the cause. Most harmful CO2 comes from general electricity production anyway.
It's not a lot if you are making six-figures. But for a lot of people it quite literally puts driving to work as too expensive.
its totally not a lot given we are talking about future of planet and humanity and that penalties on children of exactly the same people will be much higher if we won't stop pollute the planet.
(Most poor people don’t buy new cars.)
Otherwise you get BS like scrapping vehicles that took significant amounts of atmospheric carbon to produce, just because they have a slightly better gas mileage. It should only be encouraged if the total over the lifetime of the vehicle is better, but manufacturing costs are often excluded.
Plus this naturally excludes those who can't afford the upfront cost of a new vehicle - even if everything was taxed "correctly" by this logic and so was lower cost in the long run.
Automobiles only make up 14%, and that's including the big diesel trucks that move freight around.
You've got to attack the big stuff first.
40% of new electricity generation capacity worldwide in 2022 was renewable.[1]
YTD, 15% of new vehicle sales have been EV's.[2]
Heat pump market share in 2022 was 15%.[3]
1: https://www.statista.com/statistics/270281/electricity-gener... 2: https://cleantechnica.com/2023/09/10/world-ev-sales-15-of-wo... 3: https://www.grandviewresearch.com/industry-analysis/heat-pum...
Whereas nobody cares where their electricity to the grid comes from, provided it does.
EVs are an excellent option for exactly this reason: what we need is to mess with transportation minimally, ideally with benefits (i.e. quieter, cheaper fuel, maybe self-drive) but ultimately get the usage of energy for transportation disconnected from any specific fuel source.
Just listen to how the news and the average person discuss gas prices. Operating gasoline vehicles requires continuous access to affordably extracted oil. The US is so car-dependent that high gas prices in isolation can impact the economy.
EVs open options and almost certainly stabilize energy pricing more than refined gasoline. They also use less energy overall.
Sure, don't let "Perfect" be the enemy of "Better", but it's not the end solution.
They clearly were producing >> 1000x more particulates than the rest of the vehicles I saw that day, combined.
I’d guess that one car was pumping out 1,000,000x more crap per mile than a non-modified car.
The CO2 emissions haven't. That's not even remotely close.
I live in Calgary and I looked into it. $50k, which is more than 10% of the value of my house; if people are complaining about house prices right now, they will be more-so when this gets priced in.
Let me put it another way; Radon is a major problem in Canada, and any reduction is a plus. Getting radon reduction is a pittance; about $2k; however, instead of just biting the bullet and making it a mandatory part of buying and selling houses in the Praries, they leave it "to the home owner".
In short, while I agree with you, these sorts of building codes will never happen.
I understand your point but what's interesting is many folks won't even blink when you tell them their kitchen is going to be 50k or their interlock driveway and landscaping is going to be 100k. But you tell them their Geothermal is 50k or Spray foam insulation for the entire house is 30k and they look at you like you threaten their lives.
For EVs, it's obvious.
For power generation, battery technology lets us shift from coal and gas powered plants to more solar, wind, geothermal, etc... and then store that energy for when it is useful at a time when the supply from the primary energy source may not be producing but the demand is still there.
Batteries can help make fundamental changes in both of those key pieces of the economy.