All-AMD Ryzen Notebooks for Linux Gamers: USB4, AMD GPU? and PCIe-Gen-4.0 | Hacker News Reader

All-AMD Ryzen Notebooks for Linux Gamers: USB4, AMD GPU? and PCIe-Gen-4.0

opengears.medium.com

26 pointsopengears52 comments

One note, while the author recommends the 1000-nit HP Sureview display, those SureView panels have significant downsides. A short summary from a Notebookcheck review: https://www.notebookcheck.net/HP-EliteBook-865-G9-Laptop-rev... But basically, with Sure View, viewing angles are extremely compromised even with the privacy off, brightness and contrast can change w/ head motion/position, there's graininess to the display (due to the Sure View layer itself), and at least last gen's model had a <60Hz PWM, which is awful for eyestrain.

While it has an older Zen 3+ CPU, for those looking for an AMD GPU model that plays decently well with Linux, I've heard good things about the 2022 Asus Zephyrus G14. The big bonus is that being last year's model, they're usually on clearance if you can find them in stock.

Afaik here the suggestion is to get the ASUS TUF Gaming Advantage A16, but the ASUS ROG Zephyrus G14 also looks nice! (it is missing USB4, but has AMD Radeon RX 6700S and PCIe 4.0)

Hmm, are you sure that's what the suggestion is because the first line of the Verdict says: "If you want an amazing 1,000 nits (IPS) LCD — go for the HP EliteBook 865 G10, Ryzen"...

My comment directly talks about why the Sure View display is objectively not amazing, and has a lot of downsides. Also, I have an older Ryzen laptop with a 250 nit display and to me, it's basically too dark unless you work exclusively in low lighting (even sunlight from office windows made it unpleasant to work with) so I think the TUF would also be hard to recommend unless you really were someone who never looks at their screen (but then, why get a laptop?).

The G14's display I'd say is significantly better than either the TUF or the HP's. Personally, I think 350 nits would be my minimum. The G14 has a 500 nit display. It's also DCI-P3 and Pantone validated making it much more color accurate. It's a matte display, supports HDR (largely irrelevant to Linux I know), and supports 120Hz and VRR (it can actually be tweaked to 144Hz and 30-144Hz VRR, which is actually amazing to me [1]). Notebookcheck of course has a review on the display: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Asus-ROG-Zephyrus-G14-GA402R-G... (much faster pixel response, PWM at 27KHz only at <35% brightness).

USB 4 is available on the 2022 G14 via a beta BIOS: https://rog.asus.com/us/support/FAQ/1049059

[1] https://www.reddit.com/r/ZephyrusG14/comments/w9k8p3/my_g14_...

Full Ack with the screen. Wow, the Beta Bios USB4 support looks very interesting! Wondering if this is an Asus only thing, or if other Ryzen 6000 devices also support USB4? Did you experience any of the mentioned issues "Might not be able to enter Modern Standby when Thunderbolt device is connected"?

Edit: here is a "possible explanation why most ryzen 6000 laptops do not support usb 4 despite the platform technically supporting it" https://www.reddit.com/r/AMDLaptops/comments/wchl0q/a_possib...

Ryzen 6000 (Rembrandt) USB4 support was generally underwhelming. Some of it may have been FP7 limitations, but some of it may have been lack of AMD board support (eg, the ZenBooks were supposed to have USB4 support, don't have a dGPU so not a board layout issue, but was held up by BIOS issues as well). Supply chain may have played a part as well - a lot of ODM/OEMs skipped it due to parts shortages (retimers or power delivery components?). These issues are still a problem for Ryzen 7000 mobile (Phoenix). For some more color, see this Framework update for example: https://community.frame.work/t/responded-amd-batch-1-guild/2...

I did a lot of research on the G14, but actually I ended up not getting one and going for a 12th-gen Intel Framework instead: https://github.com/lhl/linuxlaptops/wiki/2022-Framework-Lapt...

I had a Batch 1 AMD motherboard pre-order but ended up cancelling for reasons, although I did end up deciding to get a 7940HS mini PC, which I'm running as my main desktop computer now and that I've documented here: https://github.com/lhl/linuxlaptops/wiki/Minisforum-UM790-Pr...

I have it connected w/ a LINKUP Thunderbolt 3 dock now and it seems fine, but I don't have auto-suspend on and don't suspend the device.

Overall, I really like the UM790 device, the main issue w/ it (that thankfully has workarounds) is that OOTB it suffers from crashes/reboots - I was able to fix it by either disabling PSS in the BIOS or disabling C6 in runtime via MSR (after which it's stable). This is likely an AMD AGESA issue (this seems to be a recurring forever bug w/ Zen processors) and an upcoming BIOS update is promised to fix it.

> ASUS ROG Zephyrus G14

I have this laptop, it works wonderfully for Linux gaming.

Dell Insperion work really well for linux too, so is the high-performance Precision laptops, they often have a software package from Dell containing all needed kernel drivers to run the laptop, however I should point out managing CPU fan and thermals is a bit weird/bad sometimes (you can either hear your laptop run the fan on full speed without running any intensive process, and sometimes you can touch the pads around the trackpad only to find your laptop is really hot), this has been also my experience with Toshiba/HP laptops on linux as well.

I worked for IBM for 10 years in the outsourcing branch. We acquired lots of "business" hardware. By far the more horrible to deal with, was HP's.

Any experience with Asus?

$215 cheaper without windows?

Why I have been told windows OEM price is around $20 all along? (windows OEM price should be public info).

To be fair, Windows 11 Pro is $215. Win 10 or Win 11 are "cheaper", but still significantly more than $20

So I have been lied to for a decade?

Need regulation to make that official public info.

Who lied to you? Microsoft?

open source software user groups fighting the mass default pre-installation of windows on PCs. As far as I could tell...

for reference, I am typing this on a minisforum um560XT which is a small desktop with a Ryzen 5600H mobile processor. The whole thing cost me under USD 500 with 500 GB SSD, 32 GB of RAM, and a windows 11 Pro license.

Somehow I doubt there was enough room for Minisforum to pay Microsoft USD 215. I would gladly take the USD 215 discount and install an operating system myself if I had a choice.

I do not think that the vendor passes on $215 to microsoft, but 215 is what HP is charging their customers

This makes a lot of sense because a company with a decent size it infrastructure team probably gets its windows licenses directly from Microsoft so there is that perverse incentive for Lenovo Thinkpads and the likes to make the sticker price high so procurement can look good when they negotiate the sticker price down to sane amounts.

I think it might be... us.

People claiming without citation (since it's all secret anyway); that the bundled crapware almost completely subsidises a Windows license. "So unbundled would only save you about $20 anyway", why fight it.

There was also this: https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/library/tech/99/... which, while massively out of date was netting people $25-$50~ who forced microsoft/OEMs to refund the windows license.

EDIT: The wikipedia page cites several cases where Dell and Microsoft have both claimed $50: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bundling_of_Microsoft_Windows

Dell of course offering $50 as a discount when buying Linux builds or "FreeDOS" out of the factory.

There's also the upcoming Thinkpad Z13 Gen 2, which is rumored to come out either this month or next month. I have the Gen 1 with a Zen 3+ CPU and it's been fantastic under Nobara (a gaming-optimized Fedora derivative) - everything works out-of-the-box including suspend/resume, and I get playable framerates even on recent games (40-45 FPS on Diablo 4) under Wine/Proton-GE.

Another option is getting a Framework laptop. The Zen 4 Frameworks are expected to start shipping from next month onwards.

Disappointing that this test doesn't report on how well suspend/resume works.

OP here. Suspend/resume worked flawlessly with Archlinux and Kernel 6.4

Correction, the Kernel was newer. 6.5.x. Here is an old probe https://linux-hardware.org/?probe=88cfdb061d

I am eagerly waiting for the Framework 16 AMD-based Laptop. First production shipments and thus independent reviews should be available Q4 2023.

Dead set. Until other companies get ontop of their waste/longevity/upgrade paths. They can duck right off. Frame work laptops or nothing. Ethics of waste > everything else. Apple is a e-waste machine along with dell and hp. Their e-waste for profit should be considered criminally negligent given today's climate.

Gross companies are gross. I love that frame.work is providing some option/fight back against the toxic businesses of yesteryear.

Fully agree. Another and more efficient path to prevent waste is to buy aftermarket (second hand) machines, and to use them the longest time possible. There are a few small vendors offering refurbished and modded hardware, for example https://minifree.org

To me the e-waste is not even the biggest selling point, but rather the ability to configure the HW yourself and adjust to your needs, through the lifetime of the laptop. Especially since I found myself having different needs over several years of usage. I.e. upgrading RAM or Storage at a later point (sad that this is even something special and worth mentioning today), but also change ports between usb-c, usb-a, ethernet, headphone jacks etc. I mean if you want you can build your own framework laptop that has 4 different headphone jacks with input/output (think streaming/podcasting setup).

I'm completely lost on current options in the laptop space, is there some reliable review site focusing on Linux-friendly laptops?

You can discuss on https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/

Here are some more online resources about that notebook

* Anyone have experience with Asus TUF Gaming A16 2023 Advantage Edition in Linux? (r/AMDlaptops) https://www.reddit.com/r/AMDLaptops/comments/159mj6i/anyone_...

* Asus TUF A16 Advantage Edition (2023) laptop compatibility check (forums linuxmint) https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=400080

> Warning: my configuration comes to $4,522.00

I often see people complaining about the "Apple tax" and that Apple sell overpriced hardware. But it seems when directly comparing to a very high quality laptop they are priced like others.

Despite better paper specs, AMD laptops have numerous issues on linux. Gaming aside, if you want a good productivity laptop, I would advise T/X Intel Thinkpads.

I use an all-AMD laptop with Linux daily.

I haven't noticed any major issues. And, in fact, I have more issues with my Intel/nVidia laptop, especially with regards to power management.

i have an all-amd laptop, works perfectly with linux

Also suspend/hibernate/resume? Which brand/model can you recommend?

I have the ASUS Zephyrus G14 and it works great. All S-states are supported and function fine.

It's Zen3, however. I would assume the Framework 13 or 16 would function equally well and are Zen4-based.

That's great. What's the build quality, is it creaky/plasticky like the cheap ones in 2010's, or are they now making it rigid/sturdy like Thinkpads were? (Didn't buy laptop for a looong time.)

It's plastic, sure (it's a midrange laptop); but solid and definitely not creaky/bendy. The screen housing is the weakest part. Not weak per se, but not as solid as the body. I would recommend watching some video reviews of it and judging for yourself.

I can recommend you look at ubuntu certified laptops, they all are more likely to work with suspend/hibernate/resume https://ubuntu.com/certified/laptops

Also the notebooks tested at phoronix.com are a good indicator to work (Lenovo Z13 for example). In the case of AMD a lot of work with suspend/resume just recently (August 2023) got patched, so generally with a recent Kernel you should be fine these days. https://www.phoronix.com/news/AMD-Linux-Fix-SR-Wakeups

yes suspend/resume, dont know about suspend to disk, not sure its done it, but i suspend/resume it ALL the time. its an ideapad flex 5. 14ALC05.

I simply installed debian, and everything works perfect

Can you let us know which exact issues you are referring to? I am running Linux on AMD (and on Intel) on different Desktops and Notebooks, and the only issues i ever experienced have been with the Lenovo Thinkpad L14 Gen2. They have been fixed with a BIOS update. https://www.reddit.com/r/AMDLaptops/comments/pdpfaq/lenovo_t...

https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/-/issues/8044

https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/drm/amd/-/issues/2354

Additionally, fan, thermals, and battery life are all subpar on my 845 g9. The fan is not even exposed via hwmon. Thunderbolt/usb 4 is also a bit iffy. There's no display before the OS boots, which means I need to open the laptop for the disk encryption password. The laptop also gets stuck in weird low frequency states after suspend/resume randomly and unpredictably. The only saving grace for this elitebook is that the wifi is not soldered, so I can upgrade it down the line. Otherwise, Intel Thinkpads are better for almost everything else, including the keyboard. Tangentially related, the mesa-freeworld mess also only exists for AMD laptops. I don't fully understand the legal gymnastics behind why Intel is not affected, but the end user experience is terrible.

all-AMD : posted on July 9

There are now 85 configurations available in the EU featuring Zen4 and DirectGPU

https://geizhals.de/?cat=nb&xf=18367_001+-+(dGPU)%7E19538_17...

But only 5 with AMD dGPU. And all of these 5 are the ASUS TUF Gaming Advantage A16 https://geizhals.de/?cat=nb&xf=17538_00+06+-+(AMD+Mainstream...

What is this insane full page ad on mobile…

Well good luck with that. I'm sure the dozen or so Linux laptop gamers in the world will be ecstatic.

I mean why wouldn't you buy a machine incapable of sufficiently cooling itself under load, with an operating system for which only a small fraction of games run well, to play games? /S

I guess it depends on the ecosystem. For Steam Linux is more used than Mac OS X (still Windows is the most popular). https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2023/08/linux-surpasses-the-...

Likely the result of the SteamDeck almost exclusively though right?

What difference does it make?

There are multiple Linux powered handhelds at this point that seem to have market traction, they are doing heavy lifting for laptops like this on the software side. I don't know any current figures and don't think quoting forecasts figures for 2027 is helpful.

I do think it's getting to the point where starting a game on a steam deck or holoiso is easier/requires less of a user than windows.

Anecdotally, every time I turn on a windows machine I'm inundated with updates. My machines using holoiso (steamos build for any x86 hardware) I just start up and they work (assuming no required game updates).

https://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/There-Are-Do...

Yeah because as everybody knows the steamdeck, which fits exactly your description, was a huge failure.

/s.

Lol. Steam deck is such a huge W - they even recently started the "Valve Certified Refurbished" program to satisfy the high demand. https://store.steampowered.com/sale/steamdeckrefurbished

> I'm sure the dozen or so Linux laptop gamers in the world will be ecstatic.

https://omdia.tech.informa.com/pr/2023/04-apr/omdia-steam-de...

And that’s only Steam Deck.

> only a small fraction of games run well, to play games?

?????

You mean most games from previous gen consoles and thousand PC games?

https://www.protondb.com/explore

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