SpaceX to launch satellites for Apple's iPhone SOS feature | Hacker News Reader

SpaceX to launch satellites for Apple's iPhone SOS feature

nola.com

38 pointsBrajeshwar28 comments

We changed the URL from https://9to5mac.com/2023/09/01/spacex-iphone-emergency-satel..., which points to this.

Submitters: "Please submit the original source. If a post reports on something found on another site, submit the latter." - https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

In this case, the original source appears to be paywalled.

https://archive.ph/AUYrP

http://web.archive.org/web/20230902094406/https://www.nola.c...

I wonder what satallite capacity is needed for voice/messages comms for 200 million users

For extremely rare emergency comms?

I imagine the next step is to allow texting like an inreach, then maybe other services like weather.

Yeah, if they allowed texting and weather it would allow me to get rid of my InReach Mini (these are the exact two services offered by the InReach Mini). I bet Garmin is squirming a bit now. I just got billed for my yearly bill from Garmin not even for service, but for the privilege of being able to resume service at any time if I want to. I will be glad for some competition in the space, even though I enjoy my InReach outside of Garmin's predatory billing practices.

How much does it cost?

https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/837461

$35 USD per year to just have the privilege of being able to turn on service, then when you turn it on it's anywhere between $15 - $65 USD per month, depending on the plan you get, plus extra billings to fetch weather. Usually when I'm using it I fetch premium weather every 2 days or so, and I usually go out for 5-10 days so it's another $5-10 USD on top of the fee. And I always get the unlimited text package (mainly for my spouse), which is the most expensive $65 plan. So a grand total of ~$110 per year since I usually average about one trip per year where I need it.

I do really like the product itself outside of the pricing. And if you're a high income earner it's not that bad for what it gives you - the actual device itself is also priced a little high, but not unobtainably so (~$250-400 USD). It strikes a really good balance between giving you the features you need to feel like you won't die if you break a leg and also able to communicate with your spouse and get weather info, while also not so high-tech that you can still feel like you're getting away from your normal device and escaping into the world.

> you won't die if you break a leg

I'm sure you're already aware, but you can outright buy (ie no ongoing cost although they're deliberately expendable) devices which solve just this narrow problem (the upkeep cost is paid by various governments) via COSPAS SARSAT. Now, in practice for a lot of people "My wife/boyfriend/mother/son worries when I'm out here" is a bigger problem than "There's a tiny risk I need rescuing" but I think it's reasonable that this peace of mind costs money at least in a world where we still unaccountably don't treat public WiFi as a normal thing society should have†

The no-ongoing cost technology is a Personal Locator Beacon and is electronically almost identical to its sisters on boats, an EPIRB, or on planes, an ELT.

† One of the the nice things about working for a University again is EduROAM, which means WiFi just works for me in lots of places because there's a university, or a college affiliated with a university or some other situation where academics were like "Why doesn't this just have WiFi like on campus?" and EduROAM means your home institution vouches for you but you can use the network anywhere on the planet.

> via COSPAS SARSAT

If you’re looking for a device, search for a 406 MHz PLB (personal locator beacon). They’re $300 to 400 and have no ongoing operating expense.

I bet Garmin is squirming a bit now.

As an inreach mini 2 owner and very, very infrequently a user, I hope so. My iPhone isn't new enough for this (13 mini) and if I get a new phone anytime soon it probably won't be Apple, but it'd be nice to see Garmin adjust their pricing.

I generally feel the same about the price; but recently on Mt Washington during a storm I was never happier to spend the $4 or whatever for 'premium' weather...3 times :)

I also drag it on road trips where I know cell service is sketchy. From what I know, part of their pricing is due to the way Iridium's network works, which is unfortunate

Oh yeah, when I was in Jotunheimen last year it was an absolute godsend due to the unpredictable rains, even if it was not perfect (it might rain in one valley out there and not the next one over). I ended up spending a little more there because I was fetching it twice a day instead of once every two days, because it was so rainy I needed to know if I could even venture out on a walk without gear.

They will need to pivot into using different constellation, potentially starlink. Also - they smart watches look pretty serious - maybe they can pull it off integrating satcom there?

Yeah I'm kinda hoping that Garmin will lower the tariffs a bit.

Qualcomm's upcoming sat comms will be cheaper, offer the same features and also uses Iridium.

They'll not be able to compete once every smartphone comes with this feature out of the box.

Globalstar doesn't support return messages. The Spot messengers have gotten less popular than Iridium ones partly because of that.

Also, Globalstar has worse reception than Iridium which is why iPhone have to be waved around.

Plus, Globalstar doesn't have worldwide coverage, they have coverage of most of continents but Pacific ocean and poles aren't covered.

It is possible these new satellites will fix those limitations.

Rare, but probably spikey within a region. Natural disasters affect many and would likely cause a flood of usage.

I don't think it was ever intended or designed to hold up in a natural disaster situation in a populated area though. Every demo or example from Apple involves being hiking out in the middle of nowhere and having a personal emergency.

Family rescued from wildfires in Maui

https://9to5mac.com/2023/08/09/family-rescued-wildfires-maui...

Absolutely, I'm not saying it can't ever work for anyone and don't bother trying if you're about to die I'm just saying Apple has never even implied the system is intended to hold up for large numbers of people in natural disaster scenarios and such a system will look very different than what they are doing. One user (or even dozens) using the service in Maui making it to a 9to5mac article is orthogonal to that, as cool as it is.

T-Mobile's plan to work with the Starlink satellites directly is a little closer in design to the question but even that is still just intended for non-populated areas. More than "how many satellites" the actual way the system works needs to be drastically different to get large numbers connected in a usable way.

I imagine it won't stay only for emergencies.

Competing offerings gewoon Qualcomm and Motorola/Bullitt offer also regular text comms.

Apple considering move to carrier services? Makes sense from perspective of iPhone sales plateauing and their move to other sources of revenue. I wonder how far are we technologically from communication directly between phones and satellites. I have no idea tbh.

SpaceX is working on Direct to Cell Phone from Satellite

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starlink#Satellite_cellular_se...

Starlink v2 satellites can do it today using T-Mobile's 1900MHz spectrum. Not sure if the service is live yet as they have only been launching v2 hardware for a few months.

Starlink recently partnered with KDDI in Japan to do the same thing for the main island and surrounding islands.

https://www.rcrwireless.com/20230831/carriers/kddi-partners-...

It isn't clear if the ones being launched have the cellphone communication capability yet.

My understanding is that the difference between the v2-Mini that are being launched now on Falcon 9, and the v2 that requires Starship, is the big antenna needed for cell phone.

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