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Comment by SideburnsOfDoom | Hacker News Reader

My related comments recently: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37233790

To your question:

- It depends on what you mean by "Agile"

- If you want to make sense of "original Agile", read "The Agile manifesto" (2001), it's 2 short pages, we can wait for you to get back.

- Criticisms of modern "agile" are actually the same as the problems that spawned that agile movement in the first place. It has become what it reacted against.

- There are practitioners of OG Agile still around and talking / Writing. Dave Farley for one.

- The scientific method does not need to be replaced, hard no. An experimental, incremental, iterative, learning framework is the way forward. The specific rituals of Jira-based scrum, those could go and not much of value would be lost.

If you're looking for a new framework, are you familiar with the Accelerate book? How about Team Topologies ? The Goal ?

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Dave Farley is a good guy and the real deal not just a talking head - I worked with him at LMAX which is where he was working when he was writing the Continuous Delivery book and that place had agility and the highest standards of engineering I've ever seen as first class concerns in the business (I was the agile guy and Dave was Head of Development both reporting into the CTO, Martin Thompson of Disruptor fame).

LeSS from Craig Larman and Bas Vodde is definitely worth a look too.

I am currently working through Mr Farley's recent book Modern Software Engineering. I'm not finding many surprises in there, I might already have passing familiarity with what he's talking about. But my comment above about scientific method is based on what I have read so far.

Taking a note from an answer up above, "the thing that needs to be revisited is implementation of agile processes / scrum in companies/projects".

Coming to another answer, where we see the management itself lacks interest in the process and rather asks to complete the task asap, it does raise question about the process.

I need to familiarize with Team Topolgies. I googled and found Martin Fowler has an article on it. Need to read that. Will check out Accelerate.

When you say, "It has become what it reacted against.", does it mean it has come full circle. A shift to new idea might be interesting here.

> complete the task asap,

Yeah, that's the usual thing is: Short term hurry, unwillingness to invest in the process get long-term gains. Ship bugs today and fix it later, instead of methodically shipping well-tested software.

> When you say, "It has become what it reacted against.", does it mean it has come full circle.

Indeed: "meet the new boss, same as the old boss".

> A shift to new idea might be interesting here.

Oh sure, if there are new ideas. But I do not think that there are better ways than a scientific method i.e.: trying out and evaluating evaluating new ideas against reality. The Accelerate book is all about evidence based suggestions on what high-performing looks like.

> A shift to new idea might be interesting here.

OK, let me ask you: Can you clearly articulate the "old ideas" that don't work any more? Can you read through the Agile manifesto, and see if it matches these "old ideas", or does it contain ideas that might help with that?

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