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Comment by pluijzer | Hacker News Reader

Elegant tools indeed. I own a (non-electric) bike that I bought 15 years ago. When I bought it I opted out of all the features, I saw them as 'parts that can break'. It was 300 euros. It gets around 10-20km of cycling everyday. I always leave it outside and lock it with the most simple lock (nobody steals such a simple bike). I carry groceries and my child on it. Twice it got a flat tire which is an easy fix, that is all the maintenance it ever got. It still works perfectly and I see no reason to replace it.

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I imagine you're either very fit or live somewhere very flat. Or don't sweat much, or you have the luxury of no commute or that of a shower at work.

you don't have to be super fit to cycle everywhere: it takes about 2-3 weeks in my experience for your body to get used to a bicycle commute even including a steep hill. just pack a clean shirt and put that on when you get to the office.

Probably Dutch based on your description ;-)

Looking at their nick I guess the author is Dutch or Belgian.

And in both countries, showers are pretty much required by local regulations in office buildings.

I've never met anyone that showers after getting to the office.

We normally just don't cycle hard enough to build up to much of a sweat.

However hot summer days are a challenge.

As a Dutch person, this seems wrong. Only one office building I've ever worked at in my life provided showers for employees, it's quite rare to see. And it would be seen as quite unusual for people to shower when they get to work.

It might be a lifestyle thing, but sweating is not really an issue. Like, a lot of people in this country have been biking their way to school and/or work their whole life, they can handle a leisurely pace on mostly flat terrain without sweating. Biking around like that is not exercise to me, it's relaxing.

Viewpoint of a Dutch national that has lived in sub-urban UK and in urban France: you're probably not realising how flat and dense the Netherlands are.

I'm not saying bikes are not a valid commuting method outside of NL. Just that in NL they are particularly well adapted

Don't know about Belgium, but there are no Dutch regulations requiring showers in office buildings[1], unless the work environment is exceptionally warm, dirty or involves dangerous chemical/biological products.

The average (non-electric) city bike speed here is probably around 10-15km/h, which makes a bike commute not any more strenuous than a literal walk (not jog) in the park. Nobody here expects people to shower after a walk. Of course it also helps that the country is very flat, the climate is mild, and cities are compact.

[1] https://www.wolterskluwer.com/nl-be/expert-insights/as-a-cli...

Why? I live in a city and also bike around 10km a day to go to work and back home. I'm not really fit and this city isn't flat either, neither do we have showers at work haha. You just get used to it after a while, really.

Car go brrrrr fast

You must live somewhere where it doesn’t regularly get over 40c

It's okay if a bicycle does not work for you. It does not make it any less elegant of a tool.

LOL, defensiveness off the scales :-)

My original comment was about cheap bikes no one wants to steal. Realistically for mass bike use ebikes are the way and that solution doesn't work. Ebikes are targets for thieves.

every bike is a target lmao

I live in Toronto and we regularly get to 35C with high humidity some summer afternoons: not too much of a problem if ride is <1 hour. Just hydrate (perhaps when you get home).

Or just don't cycle on the hottest days, but only on the 'reasonable' ones.

No one says you have to do so every day.

I live in Texas, where we had 43+ consecutive days of weather over 40C this summer.

I actually don't think the weather is even the limiting factor here in Texas. It's that it's literally unsafe to ride a bike on the vast majority of streets here under fear of serious injury or death.

Every single biking thread on HN ends up with the same arguments: well, it doesn't get freezing where you live, well, it doesn't get to 45C where you live, well, you don't have hills where you live.

People bike in any kind of environment and terrain, it's up to you to understand that ultimate convenience is not the bike's proposal, it's a simple, reliable, and fun tool to use to transport oneself when walking would take too long.

I live in a hilly place, with freezing winters (Stockholm), and I bike every single day of the year. I need 2 bikes for that: one for when it's not frozen outside and another that can take me safely on frozen/snowy ground. That's it.

When I lived in Brazil I also used to bike, in 30-40C, on a very hilly city (São Paulo) that was absolutely not made for cycling, we barely had bike lanes at that time in the city, it was still doable when distances were anywhere between 2-15km.

So yes, it's not the ultimate convenience as sitting inside your own personal refrigerated metal box but it's absolutely doable.

I mentioned this in a sibling comment: I live in Texas. Where I live we had 43 days in a row above 40C this summer. But the heatstroke chance is not even the major risk when biking in Texas. It’s that everyone here drives massive cars that are not at all designed to save bikers lives if they get hit. Many people here drive $80,000 USD trucks or SUV’s at speeds and levels of carelessness that will easily flatten cyclists. Ignoring the fact that we have a culture here that is actively aggressive against cyclists (there are people here that actually target cyclists, seriously, and there is no repercussion for them for running a cyclist over), there is, like Brazil, simply no biking infrastructure here.

So yeah any starry eyed biking idealism dies in Texas.

I also lived in Sweden (Malmö) and it was fantastic for biking. Sweden is extremely spoiled for biking infrastructure, however. In Malmö you get dedicated bike paths that are separated from the road in a raised manner (eg above the curb) and also from pedestrians. The biking infrastructure in Sweden is probably second only to the Netherlands or Denmark in that regard. And the gap between what these countries offer and what something like the USA or Brazil offers is just massive, as you almost certainly already know.

I agree that most weather situations are pretty tolerable for biking. But there are some extreme temperatures (40C, -20C) that are not conducive to biking. As long as where you live doesn’t have that as a decent chunk of a season you’re fine to use it as a commuting tool, all other things considered. The problem is really rather whether getting on the road makes you actually legitimately in a statistically founded fear for your life, as is the case in Texas.

You get fitter after a while and you can just ride slower if you don't want it to be too exhausting or "sweaty"

No doubt that is true, but to encourage people to cycle to work it's probably necessary to have a shower in the office - just to eliminate that as a source of anxiety.

You haven't met me, then :-D I used to be quite fit and lean and I'd stil sweat at the first sign of physical activity.

On the other hand, if we're both stuck in chilly weather with just shorts, a t-shirt and an unlimited supply of calories, you'll probably be the first one to freeze to death :-p

I also bike to work and meet friends every day, and it’s basically no effort. And you don’t sweat much more than walking, just ride more slowly if it’s hot out. Though I do live in a city in the Netherlands that has put some effort into making it easy.

Growing up in the US, moving here has really opened my eyes. I used to think the same as you, but it is truly easy to bike everywhere when the city you live in has invested in proper infrastructure. (Note that this infrastructure is cheap as hell too, and it really doesn’t take that much redesigning..)

I do 10km of cycling a day at a leisurely, sweat-free pace; it keeps me somewhat fit, but certainly not very fit. Admittedly I do benefit from the temperate climate of the UK.

IMHO anyone 5km from the office who's considering commuting by bike should give it a try - you certainly don't need lycra, a $1000 bike or Lance Armstrong levels of fitness.

5 kilometres is 20 minutes at a slow pace. Any bike will do, although a well maintained bike that fits you makes all the difference.

Good bike infrastructure helps a lot too. 5 kilometres in Berlin is fun. 5 kilometres in Istanbul is not.

I just started commuting by bike 11km each direction two weeks ago. I was not sure if how it was going to be before starting, but it has worked out really well so far!

I cycle in exercise clothes just not to get my clothes dirty, but I dont really need to shower when getting into work (and i get like super sweaty when i work out).

I try to adjust my pace in order to not get to warm, but it still goes way faster than the alternatives. I ride straight past the car traffic which is stuck in traffic jam every morning, and the buses are stuck there as well.

It's also an amazing way to start the day!

1. For the first 3-4 weeks you will get a workout, but after that your body will adapt and you'll be fine. This was my experience after not cycling in January and February (Toronto), and then re-starting in mid-March/April.

2. Sweating will not cause you to stink: if you shower at home before you leave, and your skin is fairly clean, then there will be no/little bacteria to cause smells by the time you arrive at work in the morning.

3. How much you sweat is up to you: if ridden at a leisurely pace (after the above few-week 'shape-up' period), you probably will not sweat. If you want to get in some cardio, then you will sweat more (but still not stink, if you pre-shower). If want a work out, you can also wear 'workout clothes' for your ride and change in a bathroom stall.

If you are in italy in the summer you will sweat even if you are just standing still

Actually you will sweat because you are standing still - while you are moving, the airflow will cool you. But if you have to stop at a traffic light, you will immediately feel the lack of cooling.

Doesn't work unless the air is dry and your clothes are not cotton.

It still works until about 60% humidity, even with cotton clothes.

You claim that 60% humidity and cotton clothes you will not be sweaty by the end of a bicycle ride under the sun in the summer?

I have lived on earth for a few years and I have very strong experimental evidence that you are incorrect.

lmao you would be soaking in 2 minutes, do you exist in our same dimension?

I'm in Toronto, Canada, where 35C summers with high humidity are quite common.

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humid_continental_climate

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto#Climate

Quite frankly, this sounds like an argument against physical activity more than anything else. Plenty of people go for morning or lunch time jogs. In my neck of the woods, and at the right time of year, plenty of people go for a morning or lunch time skate. I even see people who go for a morning row.

We should be encouraging people to live healthier lifestyles, rather than discouraging them. That is especially true for those who have sedentary jobs.

I want the bike to win as the ultimate tool, the commuting tool.

We need to be realistic about how it becomes that.

I would be happy with an equal among peers. There's nothing wrong with other modes, except that one dominates to the detriment of all others. And by detriment, I mean everything from safety to the design of communities.

Win for me wouldn't mean "destroy all competition", it would be "within cities and towns, be able to safely and efficiently go wherever any competition can go".

Let's not forget the "not too hot" part

After cycling to and from office for a couple of years every single day, some random thoughts:

* I always took a spare t-shirt with me and put it on after arrival no matter how clean and dry I felt. Taking a shower in the morning helped anyway.

* In the autumn, heavy rains were a problem: I bought special trousers and shoes not to get wet but they increased perspiration. Taking a pair of socks with me and changing my shoes and trousers solved the problem (yes I had a separate pair of trousers in my office).

* In the winter, the problem was with ice - local authorities obviously prioritize cars and pedestrians, so I had to drive slowly and avoid dedicated bike lanes.

* Always drive slowly when getting closer to the streets. I saw so many accidents - mainly young people, in professional gear but they seemed to have no imagination. Personally I cross the street only after getting visual contact with the eyes of the driver - when I'm 100% sure they see me, I can cross the street.

Yes, like someone guessed from my nickname I am dutch, and yes it is very flat and have a dedicated cycling infrastructure.

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