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Comment by screye | Hacker News Reader

It's odd that the article does not mention that Hikikomori syndrome is a disproportionately male phenomenon. Most estimates put it comfortably above 75%, with a 65%-85% tolerance range. Extreme Social withdrawal isn't an exclusively male problem, but it is hard to ignore its disproportionate impact on men.

> desperation as he quit society and normal life between the ages of 18 and 25

If your child face-plants out the gate at age 18, then it indicates gross failure of parenting and the school system.

[1] over 90% of Hikikomori are men http://ijfs.padovauniversitypress.it/system/files/papers/IJF...

[2] Findings in this study suggest that 76.4% of the cases are male and 22.9% are females. https://www.proquest.com/openview/d2fb2f85ee1b7f913be30ed142...

[3] it is estimated that there are 700,000 hikikomori (1.8% of the population between 15-39) with the male:female ratio of 7:3（66.1％：33.9％). https://ameblo.jp/lastpray/entry-10819921709.html

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I also looked into this a little more, and I believe these are out of date. It looks like it's much closer to evenly split than previously believed.

"A government survey has revealed that women make up almost half of the estimated 1.46 million people aged 15 to 64 who have withdrawn from Japanese society. It was previously believed that most of the recluses, known as hikikomori, were men." https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/news/backstories/2391/ [April 2023]

the population between 15-39 of men

you are inflating the numbers of women by increasing the age range of the population. you are including old ladies and comparing their issues to the issues of young men, full of life who are lost or disappointed by the state of the world.

I don't understand why they give up, it's really a sickness. something old ladies wouldn't understand because they are alone after they had families who abandoned because she had a terrible attitude

It's much more socially acceptable for a woman to live with her parents though her twenties than a man. It won't negatively affect her dating prospects etc.

So much of life is centered around work for salarymen. Being out of that loop means you have limited disposable income, limited social opportunities, limited dating prospects. When you're all out of options, staying in and playing games seems pretty rational.

That was my thought: Women have an opt out. Given how sexist Japan is, being a housewife isn't great but at least there's an option and some agency. Also it's far easier to be a socially reclusive woman without being judged or people thinking you're not contributing. If you want to spend all day at home with your baby/toddler, people still think of you as a responsible adult even if you never talk to other adults and spend all of your spare time on hobbies. I also believe there's some cultural sense that not being able to do things can be 'cute' for girls.

Household help (家事手伝い) had been considered to a valid job for unmarried women. Recently researchers realized that some of them are also almost Hikikomori.

I assume this has something to do with the way Japanese society as a whole looks at boys and girls.

The default assumption seems to be that boys will always fail to live up to girls in any form of studying. Because boys are rough, like games and fight, and girls are diligent and always listen.

It’s seriously hammered into children from the moment they go to kindergarden. It’s no surprise it’s some sort of self-fulfilling prophecy.

Pour a dysfunctional school system on top, and if you fail your middle school/high school/university entrance exams, your life is ruined.

If you get bullied in school, the teachers just look at you and say ‘eh, boys will be boys’.

I can see why some just nope out.

This is the central debate in the gender war, the question of nature vs. nurture in relation to gender roles. We will probably be debating this until the end of time because it is somewhat unethical to raise a baby in a padded cell and see if they prefer dolls or legos.

I must admit I used to be on team nurture before I had my daughter. But seeing the way that she personified the lego figures and takes care of them (cooks them "food", drives them to school, etc) changed my mind. You can give dolls to boys too, but they're more likely to hit each other with them than nurture them. That drove home that most of this is really built into the firmware.

I doubt that. Children learn by observing. And there are still more women than men in nurturing positions.

There's a few problems:

1) obviously, the initial, first, nurturing position will be a woman (womb + immediately after. It can't even be a transgender). And we can change a lot with medicine, but we can't change this. We're not 1-2 years, or even 10-20 years away from changing it. It'll be centuries.

2) When we try to use law to fix this, the big example are the Nordic countries. They were among the first to loosen up professions and have very flexible laws. But the proportion of women in nurturing positions actually went up instead of down. Now this may be local cultural attitudes asserting themselves of course, but if this doesn't work ... what will?

Ironically, it is our boy that personifies figures and plays with them. Does do some fighting, but no more than our daughters did.

He is also the one that gravitated towards cars and trucks. So, it isn't like he is against all stereotypes.

Children learn and play by mimetism. Me and my brother cooked a lot, as children, because my father was cooking most of the time (my sister still picked it up, but way latter).

I have been a summer camp counselor (and for 2 years a counselor year round at a non-profit, making physic and chemical experiments with kids, that's what brought me to CS) and I'd say role models are a big chunk of a kid outward character (at least before 12). Social group is another chunk, and obviously hormones is the last one dictated by first gender, but also food, and physical activity. Which to me is underrated. You aren't born as an adrenalin junkie, you become one. I've always been very meek and passive. Then I started windsurfing in hard/dangerous weather, and that totally changed my character. The 'surfer boy' cliché is real, but it's something you become, not something you are.

I found it a bit strange that in a photo captioned "Metaverse socialising events are one of the measures being used to ease the hikikomori back into society," Takimoto is watching a YouTube video of the (excellent) Final Fantasy 6 soundtrack.. Just poor captioning I guess.

Interesting that he "cured" himself by having an internal debate between his hikikomori self and his ideal self. Sounds a little like cognitive behavioral therapy where you identify and challenge your negative beliefs to determine whether they're correct.

> If your child face-plants out the gate at age 18, then it indicates gross failure of parenting and the school system.

Or of society at large.

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