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Comment by ianai | Hacker News Reader

I’m not seeing reputable sources reporting ford got bailouts. Nor do I see ford on this list. https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list

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It's in the first paragraph of the linked article [1]. They were called "loans" in the government-speak of the post-2008 crash, but if you look at the semantics, they were just risk-free bailouts.

[1] "the U.S. Secretary of Energy will be giving details about the first loans to come out of the government’s $25 billion program to help auto manufacturers. Ford got a $5.9 billion loan, but Tesla Motors, Silicon Valley’s electric car manufacturer, is receiving $465 million from the program"

How is not a loan if they’ve been repaying it?

Can I, just a random citizen, get a loan from the government for not even billions or hundreds of millions but let's say $100,000? I will of course repay "in due course, at the appropriate juncture, in the fullness of time" [1], at 0% interest.

There is nothing loan-like in government "loans" (of 2008, or of 2021, see the PPP heist [2]) almost by definition: no interest, no shares changing hands, not even a share buyback restriction (how most of the government loans are spent anyway).

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKYEUXlYcSI

[2] "How Did PPP Scammers Steal $100+ Billion", https://www.aura.com/learn/ppp-loan-fraud

Bailout or not, the loan was however repaid nine years ahead of time in 2013.

https://www.cnbc.com/id/100759230

Looks like Ford argued for it in 2009 and in 2010 didn’t take it. https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/59862-rejecting-...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Icon:_Alan_Mulally_...

Just avoiding the inevitable I suppose: June 22, 2023, "Ford agrees to $9.2 billion US government loan" [1].

That's the joke in the end: there are no companies (and there is no government), just a bunch of chaebols [2], at least South Koreans don't lie to themselves.

[1] "Ford previously took out a $5.9 billion loan under the program in 2009. That loan was fully repaid as of last year (2022), according to the DoE. [3]", https://edition.cnn.com/2023/06/22/business/ford-department-...

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaebol

[3] https://www.energy.gov/lpo/ford

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