I would love to know of another service or product where NOT using the product results in being detained. Airlines sound more and more like a cartel than anything these days.
The other way to fix it would be to charge every leg at direct flight prices and then offer a rebate for completing your full itinerary.
It sounds like abuse of market power, rather than an honest supply-demand with an eye on their costs, thing. They try to extort more for the shorter trip due to artificial scarcity.
It’s way more expensive to fly into smaller regional hubs like Charlotte because the supply of airlines that want to maintain a presence there is smaller than a national hub like New York City.
That’s how you get these upstart airlines that take over a corner of the US when the prices get too high. Then the big airlines drop their prices to compete because the supply went up.
There are effectively four major airlines. That’s just not nearly enough to avoid anti-competitive bullshit like this.
https://www.airfarewatchdog.com/blog/50066526/airline-hub-gu...
And Charlotte in particular:
https://www.wfae.org/local-news/2020-01-14/faq-city-why-do-f...
> So, you're probably wondering, why does American control most of the flights here? It's because Charlotte Douglas International Airport is an American hub. The airline has 90% percent of the nearly 700 daily flights here. That lets it set whatever price it wants, says Ted Reed of Charlotte, who covers airlines for Forbes.
> The answer is pretty simple: We're basically a one-airline town. There's little competition for American Airlines, says Scott Mayerowitz , the executive news director thepointsguy.com, a website that tracks the cost of flying.
> "It is pure supply and demand."
> "Well, I don't want to minimize the fact that this is a monopoly carrier … basically a monopoly company providing service," says Reed. "So of course, they're going to charge more. But a lot of people think the the trade-off is worth it and you know, and that's why you see the companies move here, a lot of companies move here because of the service."
> "People always say to me: Fares are too high and the airlines are horrible. But yet the parking lot at the airport is always full."
Wether 90% (or X%) market share qualifies as a monopoly is an age-old debate.
It really isn’t much of a debate
I've never heard of a normal pay-per-item one doing it.
I realize America doesn't work this way but it's something I think a lot of people would agree with
One day our friend was ill but three of us weren't going to miss the only sunny day of British summer so we went without him.
The ticket agent on the train was quite insistent that we were breaking the rules...and I guess in some sense we were, as the tickets did say four people had to travel together. We ended up with a "One time courtesy exception" so we could continue our journey.
National Rail later revised the program to a 33% discount for groups of 3 or more.
They wanted to question him, probably in a private area. He wasn’t getting on any of their flights w/o answering so he went along with it.
That’s literally detaining him, so I am not sure what you’re objecting to here.
If you have a flight to catch, of course, the calculus changes but once that becomes a lost cause, all bets are off.
If I miss my flight I'm more motivated to catch the next one, not test my available civil liberties in front of poorly-paid ex-military. Best case you end up detained (in the real sense) for a long time and potentially acquitted in court, months later and having incurred plenty of mental trauma. Worst case you just go to jail. Sounds like a lose-lose
Ha. Ha. Suddenly everyone's an expert in what constitutes detention. There's actually a big difference between "literally not detaining" someone and not detaining someone.
I think the detention naysayers in this thread have failed to consider that the people who practice this type of behavior are experts. Frequently the whole business of these interrogators is to make sure that someone is "not literally" detained, but that they are in fact detained, in the sense that they do not feel free to leave. In this way, the interrogator has not committed a crime or malfeasance by falsely detaining a person, but they isolate them and make them feel as though they need to answer questions.
The worst part is that there is almost no clear coaching for how a person is supposed to get through this type of situation. With the police, we can give clear advice: (1) ask "am I being detained or am I free to leave?" (2) Refuse to engage in conversation; (3) Ask for a lawyer. But these aren't police. They will tell you that you are not being detained. They have a few hundred dollars of your money and maybe a bunch of your clothes, and they just need you to answer a few questions before you get on the plane.
What are you going to say? "I refuse to answer questions without a lawyer"? "I refuse to remain in this tiny office answering questions"? Ok. Great. You're banned, and maybe turned over to TSA for a real custodial interrogation for acting so suspiciously at an airport.
Anyway, all this to say that your word games with "literally" this and that are not clever because this is actually much worse than a real custodial interrogation because the rights and obligations are much less clear and that lack of clarity accrues to the corporation's advantage.
In this case I would just declare that I'm leaving and if any resistance, demand the real cops be called or call them yourself. Same if they refuse to return your cash and/or luggage.
And the person in question is a teenager.
In a more well-adjusted society this would not be considered legal and people wouldn't be defending it.
Not true. Before you buy someone a skiplegged ticket you explain to them how this works. Why their ticket will say a different destination from where they want to go and why the airlines want to discourage the practice. Explain what things can go wrong (no checked-in luggage, things can go wrong with diversions).
If someone can’t understand the concept, or it confuses them, or they are too naive or too honest to play this “deception” or too busy to receive this information then just don’t and buy a regular ticket.
> What are you going to say?
Simple. They might ask you where you are traveling to. Answer “new york”. If they ask “but where are you really traveling?” answer “new york man, how many times you want to ask the same question?” if they ask you anything about New York answer whatever you want as long as the answer implies you are planing to go there.
On the other hand, I think a lot of the difficulty in situations like this comes from not knowing that this is about the "skiplag" issue (or not knowing if it's only about that issue). I think there's also a likely scenario where the airline starts investigating you for one thing and just sort of throws the book of accusations at you when they don't like how the skiplag interrogation is going.
My first comment was more about that: the private actor interrogating people without clear rules or limits.
That’s detainment by coercion at least.
> A teen traveling solo for the first time from Gainesville, Florida to Charlotte was taken to a security room by American Airlines. There he was interrogated – and forced to buy a new ticket – according to the boy’s father.
What is your definition of "detained"?
They probably intimidated him into coming with them and he agreed / complied.
> according to the boy’s father
Who wasn’t present.
The airline may have asked nicely and the son complied and never tried or asked to leave. That’s not being detained. We will probably only know the details if this goes to court and it comes out or if video of the interaction is released.
If I am going about my business, but you request that I stop what I'm doing to follow you to have a chat, you are detaining me. period. you pussyfooting around this like it's not is just disingenuous at best
Was this the government police doing this? Or a private company?
> If I am going about my business, but you request that I stop what I'm doing to follow you to have a chat, you are detaining me. period. you pussyfooting around this like it's not is just disingenuous at best
So all of those “on-the-street” YouTubers asking questions are detaining people? Even if those people don’t stop?
maybe you'd prefer the word accosted?
www.law.cornell.edu/wex/detain
> In criminal law, to detain an individual is to hold them in custody
> Custody is the state of physically holding or controlling a person
If a person positions to block my way (especially in an official capacity), this is detainment, brief as it may be and as hard as it may be to prove in a trial.
Its detaining someone in either case, though the difference you point to makes a difference in whether it is illegal (or, at least, in which law controls whether it is.)
As a civilian, I can ask a lost child what their guardian was wearing to help locate them without breaking laws surrounding interrogation. Similarly, I can ask a child if they intend to fly to New York or if they intend to get off in North Carolina.