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Comment by chx | Hacker News Reader

> That doesn’t really exist any more.

But the lack of driver support still does. Linux on a modern laptop is just full of headaches. I mean, https://www.phoronix.com/review/amd-ryzen7-7840u this is typical: GNOME doesn't work, graphical glitches... In my own experience, operating MFC devices over several years is a nightmare, Bluetooth is problematic as well, some proprietary VPNs do not have Linux clients which might not be Linux's fault but if I can't log in I can't work.

Life is too short for this, sorry. Windows + WSL is the way. The right tool for the right job, Windows for drivers, WSL for, well, everything else.

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> I mean, https://www.phoronix.com/review/amd-ryzen7-7840u

So, they took a cutting edge Windows PC, slapped Linux on it, and it didn't work well.

How well did OSX do when they tried it? Clearly, OSX isn't ready for the desktop! No wonder nobody runs it!

Modern computers are complex enough that they can work well with Windows, OSX, or Linux, but they don't work well with more than one of them (unless the designers work really hard). See, for example, how to reboot: https://mjg59.livejournal.com/137313.html

If you want to run Linux on a computer, buy it preinstalled, with support. Anything else is an exercise in chasing down small glitches, as you describe. (This happens for Windows too! The difference is that the laptop vendor has a team of people (the system integration team) to fix the issues, either by modifying drivers, modifying the firmware, or having the ODM change the hardware. If you slap Linux on some random bit of Windows kit, you get to be the system integration team, but with only one of three avenues open to you to fix the glitches. And that only halfway, since you cant get the OEM or ODM to give you the time of day. And that's assuming you're a proficient kernel hacker.)

Slapping Linux on a Windows box is a mug's game. The only way to win is not to play.

So true. If you get a System76 laptop you can get some really amazing hardware and make sure to never pay the Windows license fee.

It's not about the fee (generally it's small for you (though for the OEM it's critical, and one of the ways MSFT gets OEMs to do their bidding (a small example is how they all "recommend Windows" on their sites; it's a discount on the fees they pay MSFT)). The fee also is why you get so much crapware on new Windows boxes.

It's about the hardware's support of the OS (see the firmware discussion above).

It's also about your support experience as a customer (do you have to reinstall Windows before the OEM will give you the time of day, let alone fix the hardware glitch you're hitting)

)

System76 won't make MFC drivers for every MFC there is or make Linux clients for wacky corporate VPNs and Wifi appear.

Sure, because they (or whoever) don't make it.

Many printers, especially the MFC ones, support Linux. For instance, Brother has drivers: https://help.brother-usa.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/52188/~...

WRT corporations, they can do what they like with their own hardware and software. And yes, a lot are short-sighted. Most won't be using Mac any time soon, because they've locked themselves in quite effectively.

i dunno. i work on completely cross platform things and use a system76 laptop and the experience is still pretty garbage. the real problem is the linux userspace. its a huge arbitrary mess that is made worse by the insane number of packages that have to work together for a remotely usable desktop experience.

it's possible of course, but invariably breaks, especially if you need to install any single third party thing.

i hate flatpak etc but it really makes u think about why people are putting effort into fat packages for desktop stuff

Sounds like the problems you describe would be fixed by Guix or Nix. You should give one of those a try, or even use them on your existing distro!

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