Resting does give you benefits, but they are not those of sleep. You cannot replace sleep with rest and expect anything comparable. I don't remember the primary source but I do know it was emphasised in sleep management policies in military contexts.
That said, I agree with your overall theme. Get some relaxation and don't worry so much about the sleeping. It takes training to learn how to nap, especially in the high-stimulus environments of today. But if you stress over sleep, well, that surely won't get you to sleep!
I agree with the parent comment you replied to.
There's a middle mental relaxation state that is not deep sleep, which will give enormous benefits for mental freshness aftwerwards. I identify it when my mind is no longer "driven" by my conscious process but is wandering off, and I am awake and aware of this status.
I really enjoy this state, but I find it hard to keep it going for very long. Pretty soon I think about how great it is that I'm not thinking, and it's all over.
Can you be a little bit more specific? I'd be interested to hear what the counterpoint is as personally I feel refreshed after a 15 min lie down in the back of my car at work, even if I didn't perceptibly fall asleep.
You can make as bullshit claims as you want that will be logically sound
The best examples of this are conspiracy theories
What I'm saying is, "you don't know a thing 'cause it's not your field" is a good heuristic in absence of any extra information, but if the logic is sound, the author seems to have high generic skills in reasoning/logic/rationality and good model of the world, and no one closer to the field is raising any specific objections, then that heuristic breaks down, as it's becoming more likely that the author got the gist of it right.
>logic is sound, the author seems to have high generic skills in reasoning/logic/rationality and good model of the world
What is good model of the world? The one that is coherent with yours?
Ive witnesses too many stupid ideas based on this "sounds logically" that Im fully against suggestions like this
But there is solution!
Just put effort into learning your stuff, so you aint gonna have to make a guess and waste time convincing yourself how rational your "not so educated guess" may sound
There are topics we don’t know the truth on, so we have to theorize. For instance, dark matter, or origins of Covid, or evolution, even. We could throw our hands in the air and say “we don’t know anything”, but part of coming into knowledge is taking an educated guess on the answer, testing it, and being right or wrong. From there, we recalibrate.
The problem comes when people dogmatically defend their old, disproven hypotheses in the face of insurmountable evidence. Not situations where people have valid critiques or are skeptical, but situations which are pretty open-and-shut. For instance, flat earth has always seemed to me to be a very obviously wrong theory.
But to technical people, it was a sound theory, that proofed out to be right.
That's the difference between a theory that lizard people invented Covid, or that Kubrick shot the moon landing. Those theories fall apart very quickly, if you apply logic.
So I am no fan of appeal to authority arguments. If the experts are real experts, then they can use logic, to simply show where the layperson's arguments are flawed, where it is missing context or deep understanding of the field and point in the right direction. But if they cannot - then maybe the layperson has a point.
- 1. listening to my body's tiredness is probably a safer general strategy than pushing myself to the brink as a general strategy. It would be extremely surprising if this was not the case, going in the face of thousands of years of folk wisdom and decades of research. I'd welcome that finding since it'd be a rich source of future discoveries, turning much of common wisdom about sleep and rest upside-down
- 2. it confirms my biases about the ideas I've liked and cherry-picked from [0], [1], [2], and [3] :^) - I'm willing to update my beliefs in the face of new analyses/results, but is there really any epistemological way for me to try to derive real life benefit in a valuation-free way? At some point one makes a lossy approximation of reality in one's desired habits. At some level this is scientism, sure, since it's dangerous to assume one's observations are reality itself, but, it keeps me happy enough with the results. And it's fun to watch the meshing together of ideas over the years, as research pierces deeper into the world's veil..
I'm not the arbiter of the mechanics of internal bodily conscious experience, however, so, grains of salt and all that ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
[0] Partial sleep in the context of augmentation of brain function (2014), https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24822040/
[1] The visceral theory of sleep (2013), https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23697225/
[2] Integrated Information and State Differentiation (2016), https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4923128/
[3] Topographic-dynamic reorganisation model of dreams (TRoD) – A spatiotemporal approach (2023), https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S01497...
Otherwise it's some form of rest rest but I still feel tired. It's extremely annoying trying to concentrate when feeling tired.
So yes, a nap is valuable even if you feel you didn't drift off, but it is not necessary to invoke mental energy expenditure as an explanation.
I’d often sit in my car at lunchtimes and do a guided meditation.
It did help during my corporate days.
Lying in bed trying to sleep doesnt count as sleep
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19379769/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29717187/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29883710/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31852988/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34011516/
I’m certainly not arguing that the science is settled on this, but it seems far too strong a statement to say that “all known evidence points against this” when I could find several studies supporting OP’s point pretty much instantly.