They say the people get the government they deserve though.
I don't believe that my government will turn to tyranny suddenly when it's generally had a pretty good history of not going off the rails. I don't buy the slippery slope argument/fallacy.
>They say the people get the government they deserve though.
Touche. I'd be more concerned about this in the US with your highly polarized yo-yo politics.
As far as your government turning to tyranny. I can't think of many governments that turned to tyranny multiple times. They are usually removed, or stay in power. "My government is not currently tyrannical so I'm confident it will stay that way", is a strange way to think if you've read much history, imo.
Yes, and I'm arguing for stricter enforcement of current laws around these topics. I'm not saying that people can't discuss immigration policy. I'm saying that people shouldn't discuss immigration policy through inciting to violence and racism. And I'm saying that Elon Musk is absolutely the last person I'd want to be the arbiter of what speech is legal or not.
Yes, the Norwegian government has some not so great history of discriminating against the native population hundreds of years ago, the Roma people last century, LGB people ~30 years ago and most recently drug users. But thinking that "Because there's always a slim chance my government can go rogue we should minimise its power" is a strange and uniquely American way of thinking by the way. My views are not uncommon in Europe. But they are at odds with the US/Libertarian slant you find here.
>I'm saying that people shouldn't discuss immigration policy through inciting to violence and racism. And I'm saying that Elon Musk is absolutely the last person I'd want to be the arbiter of what speech is legal or not.
Yes and I still think I'd rather be kicked off twitter by Musk than locked in a jail for saying the wrong thing. I honestly have no idea why you believe that the members of your government are more fair/just/whatever than anyone else, including Musk. They're not, and that's why they should have limited power.
I'll just dip out of this conversation right here. We have a fundamentally different view of how society is built up, functions and should work.
> Your views may not be uncommon, but they're certainly not universal, and even if they were, that wouldn't make them correct, or even well thought out.
Touche.
At the risk of seeming like I need the last word and further risk of sounding very cliche, there is a quote by a man named Martin Niemöller, a German man, about a German government, that I believe, tells us in no uncertain terms, that the slippery slope fallacy is not a fallacy AT ALL, and that we should take government powers and limits extremely seriously.
> Germany have criminalized basically any positive display/speech about their past tyrannical government.
Germany went through the worst case scenario of hate speech. Hate speech is strictly regulated there because they know the dangers it poses and how it can make normal people into monsters. While many factors went into the rise of Hitler, hate speech was a fundamental part of how precisely Hitler got to power. Hate speech enables populists power through simple emotional messaging. Any idiot can do it, and many do. And lots of people fall for it. I don’t want emotional messaging controlling our politics (precisely like what’s happening with the culture wars in the US) I want boring, research backed, evidence-based policy made and championed by bureaucrats and domain-experts with decades of experience.
There’s a reason hate speech is being researched and platforms are being forced to deal with the unmoderated hate speech of the 2010s. It has vast political power in the wrong hands. And it inevitably leads to shit policy.
I 100% support discussion about immigration or if identity politics has gone too far. I 100% support the deplatforming of voices that stigmatise, discriminate, silence and incite violence towards these minorities on major platforms.
"First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out – because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out – because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out – because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me – and there was no one left to speak for me.”
Which is weird because the US government is easily in the top 5 rogue governments around the world.