The role of cat eye narrowing movements in cat–human communication (2020) | Hacker News Reader

The role of cat eye narrowing movements in cat–human communication (2020)

nature.com

236 pointsbookofjoe88 comments

I actually use this trick all of the time now and it's actually pretty effective.

A slow blink when looking at a cat signifies that you don't see them as a threat. So it can help relax strange cats, and it is also a cue from the cat that they are okay with you approaching them.

Were you actually surprised?

I use this trick for years, in my experience yawning theatrically gets the same result

The yawning also helps calming down the guard dogs protecting sheep herds in the mountains.

Huh, thanks for the tip. I'll try this next time I meet a patou!

This is a generic dog "non-agression" signal as far as I understand. Licking your nose (or at least pretending to do so) works similarly.

Absolutely! Dogs use yawning a lot in their communication if you look close enough. They also have other messages like smelling around, looking away, etc. I think they all might mean something along the lines of "I don't see you as a threat to me so we are good"

Cats also regard looking away as a friendly gesture. Which is probably one reason they anecdotally tend to seek out the company of the one person who is allergic or does not like cats. Humans not accustomed to cat body language tend to think of looking away as a sign of aloofness and disinterest instead.

Some people jokingly say that cats are autism and dogs are ADHD and if you know people who are autistic or have ADHD, the parallels are fairly obvious. Autistic people also struggle with other humans insisting on eye contact.

As do Finns (I'm one), and people of many other non-American cultures. And many non-autistic but shy or introverted or highly sensitive persons. You seek eye contact momentarily when you make a point in a conversation, or respond to a point made, or want to empathize, or whatever. Prolonged or too frequent eye contact is weird.

That said, cats very much do stare at your face when they want or are expecting something, usually food. They also have the adoring eyes-half-open stare mode you can see examples of at r/Catsmiring.

I would say that cats better fit the introvert archetype, and dogs the extrovert one, rather than something from the DSM. Anecdotally there's also a significant positive correlation with their respective owners' personalities.

> Humans not accustomed to cat body language tend to think of looking away as a sign of aloofness and disinterest instead.

But not always. For instance, a common sign of flirting in humans is to repeatedly catch someone's eye and then look away.

They're called calming signals, and the reason they're calming is because they make it obvious that the individual isn't "on alert".

If the individual means you harm, they're going to be paying close attention to your every movement since they're about to attack. They'll be staring directly at you, sizing you up, preparing to pounce.

Looking away, smelling around, yawning, slow blinking or eye closing, are all boondoggles that signal, as you said, "hey, I feel at ease with you enough to do this idle busywork, almost as though you weren't here at all because I don't see you as a threat or target".

Yawning probably goes back at least to the first mammals, it's pretty hard-wired as a standard mammalian social cue signifying a calm and relaxed affect and being in the "rest and digest" parasympathetic mode. It's contagious across species, and even thinking about yawning makes you want to yawn!

Yes but humans have also co-opted it to mean something like “you’re losing my interest,” which seems funny to me. I wonder if there are more examples of instinctive behaviors being deployed sarcastically in humans.

Well, there's of course sarcastic smiling and sarcastic or scornful laughing, the "genuine" forms of both being partly involuntary responses. Another interesting reflex action that's been deployed socially by humans is clearing one's throat to politely request attention.

I'd bet it works on human too. Will update you on that.

For maximum results, lie sideways on the ground and start blinking slowly and petting yourself gently and meowing softly.

Your friends will think you're crazy, but cats will love you.

While I understand this comment is made in jest, I do wonder whether cats are able to “map out” or recognize body parts of humans as parts equivalent on the cat body plan.

I have always wondered that about eyes in general: I'm not sure if I'm daft or not, but it seems surprising to me that animals with any intelligence look at us in the eyes.

Why fixate on the face and not, say, our hands or body, if they might be afraid of us, to determine if we are a threat? Eyes must provide a higher signal of intent, so it's surprising that even animals on a much lower level of intelligence can read our facial expressions.

I'm not sure if it's a good or a stupid question.

It's not a stupid question. It's a matter of stages of engagement.

The face and eyes indicate intention. You can't successfully track or kill without focusing your full attention on the object, and the easiest way to detect this is by seeing where the eyes are focused.

Once a threat is determined, then focus moves to other body parts.

My understanding is, in general, yes. At least major body parts and face parts. Even ones that differ (eg. our ears vs their ears).

Think about it this way how can you kill successfully if you don't have a basic understanding of the anatomy of what you're trying to kill?

I think a general body map is hardwired into more vertebrates. Heads always have eyes, ears and move around. Arms are on the upper torso and legs are at the end of the torso, tails are common.

Beyond that level, your guess is as good as mine though.

Anecdotal answer from a cat person: yes. My cat gives me "hugs". He stands on his hind legs on my lap so our hearts are touching and his cheek is against my cheek. It's quite touching. He seems to know what my heart is and what my cheek is, and puts his own versions against mine.

It's precious.

My wife uses this approach with our cat and it works. However, when I try it he pays no attention - could be that I've been his main servant for 18+ years so of course I don't see him as a threat or I have glasses any my wife doesn't or sheer feline contrariness ....

I think the cat's slow blink is functionally related to a human smile, which when truly felt, also causes the eyes to close and then open slowly.

I've noticed that my two Siamese cats often combine the slow blink with either a bowing of the head or lifting of the chin. They also very often yawn while making eye contact when my wife or I enter the room.

Not a cat person, but I've worked with raptors. Staring at them tends to mean "I intend to eat / fight you". I understand this to be true of lots of mammals as well (e.g. you should avoid making eye contact with wild bears that you encounter). I can therefore interpret the slow blink as 'defusing' the aggressiveness / threat of a direct stare.

> Cat’s eye movements were coded using actions defined in CatFACS, an anatomically based system designed to objectively measure facial actions based on their underlying muscle movements.

Whoever named this system was clearly aware of the meme. I'd like to remain subscribed to CatFACS, please!

Haha, in case you're not aware, FACS is an well established system for categorizing human face movements https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facial_Action_Coding_System

Did you know, cats are believed to be the only mammals that don't taste sweetness! To unsubscribe at any time, reply STOP to this message.

I have heard (and perhaps misremembered) that the only taste receptor remaining to whales detects saltiness, which seems a bizarre outcome given that their mouths are constantly filled with brine.

Maybe because it is useful for the whale to know if it suddenly entered freshwater? Idk

https://animalfacs.com/catfacs_new (cats)

https://animalfacs.com/dogfacs_new (dogs)

https://animalfacs.com/equifacs_new (horses)

https://animalfacs.com/chimpfacs_new (chimpanzees)

https://animalfacs.com/maqfacs_new (rhesus macaques)

https://animalfacs.com/gibbonfacs_new (hylobatids / lar gibbons)

https://animalfacs.com/orangfacs_new (orangutans)

https://animalfacs.com/callifacs (marmosets)

I'm looking forward to more funny looking facs:

probofacs (proboscis monkey)

axolotlfacs (mexican walking fish)

alpacafacs (alpaca)

starfacs (star-nosed mole)

batfacs (bat)

blobfacs (blobfish)

frillfacs (frilled lizard)

I do this all the time to my cats. Sometimes the cat will trill back like "oh, got it", which is about equal parts interesting and cute.

> Sometimes the cat will trill

Might be at maximum "P," especially if it was darting toward you immediately preceding this.

Next time try hanging some spinning pieces of catnip from your rafters to see if your cat can temporarily levitate in order to collect them.

What?

This appears to be a reference to Mario's "P-Speed", which indicates that raccoon Mario is running fast enough to fly.

Mario, when running at full speed, has a little trill audio.

Thanks, I would have never figured that out :D

I have to say I do like the idea of trying this out literally as I wrote it and testing what happens. :)

I mean it's catnip after all, so the cat may indeed attempt to levitate like Mario in order to collect it.

Slow clap. I mean blink.

My cat does this too! There is a "got it" flavored affirmative trill, and also a "come on!" flavored frustrated trill.

There's also the "you touched me" trill. Also the "oh, hai!" trill.

Literature says cats can't understand it when you point at something. That's because they don't have fingers. You can point at things using your eyes and they understand. One day I was eating some fruits and a stray cat came to me and started meowing. I gave it a piece which it rejected and started meowing again. I stared for a couple seconds at my plate and then at the piece on the ground and the cat looked like it understood and stopped meowing.

Thanks for pointing - ha - that out! It totally makes sense to use visual communication because of course no fingers! Made me chuckle because it seems obvious yet, no, gear shifting for cats makes sense.

Yeah they have much less brain volume devoted to their paws. This is why, even though they are incredibly agile animals, they always look a bit dorky trying to manipulate something with their paws. For survival purposes they can rely on sharp hooks, and don't need dexterity.

This is interesting. I've had both cats and dogs, and with the theory "they don't have fingers" I wonder why do dogs understand human pointing? Dogs of course communicate with a direct gaze (looks at empty food bowl, looks at human, looks back at empty food bowl) and can understand us communicating back with a directed gaze, but at the same time my dog definitely understands me pointing at something.

Dogs are not wolves. They have evolved to read and somehow become more like us. I bet a wolf can't understand a pointed finger, just like they can't read sadness on your face. A dog can do both quite easily.

What's more fascinating to me, is that the relationship is not one-sided: we might have learned something from wolves as well. They have changed us, just like we turned aloof wolves into empathetic dogs. Maybe they have made our society more social, and less isolated? Wolves know there is strength in numbers.

Maybe cats in general don't understand pointing, but both of my cats do. One of them is quite intelligent, so I'm not surprised there, but even the stupid (but adorable) one gets it.

Friendly cats often look sort of sleepy to me, maybe because they do this slow blink sequence when I look at them?

sometimes they are just sleepy but they are only sleepy like that when they are comfortable around you and don't see you as threat.

The persistent eyes-half-open state means they're relaxed and resting and yes, consider you a friend so they can afford to be relaxed and resting. They're usually also affectionate and very receptive to pets in that mode. Slow blinks can accompany the half-open-state, or a cat may use a slow blink to go from wideish to half-open eyes.

We don't understand cat facial expressions as intuitively as dogs

For example, what we would traditionally see as a grumpy or angry face (eyebrows down, eyes narrowed slightly) is the relaxed face of a cat

An angry cat's face on the other hand is wide open eyes, ready to attack back

I had a siamese mix cat that did this. It seemed to mean "hey. I see you." A kind of recognition with a touch of affection. Its definitely part of the cat language.

I've been explaining this to my kids for years when they meet the neighbourhood cats. Angry cats glare at each other, and this is basically the opposite. I guess science has caught up!

jackson galaxy from 'my cat from hell' TV show uses this trick all the time . Its a cup all cat owners pickup after a while.

That show and his Youtube channel are always a recommendation of mine to any new cat owner or person who doesn't have cat experience but wants to learn cat culture.

I watched a marathon of 'my cat from hell' around when I first got my two boys (they are 8 now) and I really think what I learned from watching jackson break down cat issues has helped me raise them into the sweeties they are today.

My wife and I did this when we adopted our first cat. It's been incredibly helpful. As someone who had never interacted much with cats before that, and who was kinda afraid of them, Jackson Galaxy helped me see cats as little cute killing machines that can be as affectionate - if not more - than dogs.

His book is also very good!

Little cute killing machines sums it up pretty well! One moment they are cute and cuddly, only to go full on predator when a bird flies by...

I grew up with cats and at some point my wife and I started noticing that I was doing the slow-blink to her the same way cats do it and then I realized I had been doing it all my life to humans and cats alike. I'm not sure what to make of that.

Man, how cute is this paper?

Yeah, when I worked on programming language semantics our papers had no photos and a lot more predicate calculus.

The pics in the paper could be of my little guy, so I'd have to say pretty cute. Otherwise, I might hear about it later

I've heard that cats blink to show affection in part because they don't have a lot of face muscles to do anything else. As someone who has had both dog and cat pets, it does seem like the dogs have a vast array of emotions they can display with their faces, and cats pretty much just stare and look like they're about to kill something. They can scruff their fur but they can't "smile" like dogs or look "guilty", they seem more static.

There are a fairly large number of basic grammatical errors in this paper, which seems unusual for a paper of the quality normally expected by Nature.

The irony is that the cat was also studying the human.

You’re thinking of mice, which are merely the protrusions into our dimension of vast, hyper-intelligent pan-dimensional beings who have been running the Earth as an experiment since Deep Thought designed it.

Under the mice? Turtles all the way down.

I like the use of the term "dyad".

I also note "inter-specific" in the first sentence.

I slow blink at my cats all the time, and they usually respond. And when they do it first, I always make sure to slow-blink back at them. Can't leave them hanging. We call it the "love eye".

Smiling is also important. Most animals I encounter seem to understand a broad smile as friendly and non-adversarial, especially cats and dogs.

Smiling without teeth, at least for dogs. Smiling with teeth is a sign of either aggression, or very rough play.

I wonder when they will understand that in Hollywood :)

Around the same time they realize breaking formation and running a half marathon charge against the enemy, while screaming at the top.ofnyour lungs, is a bad battlefield tactic.

So never.

FWiW the Australian light horse charged flat out across four miles of open ground (ie. broken formation) into machine gun nests and snipers to take the Battle of Beersheba, the charge was with rifles slung across backs while holding reins and bayonets.

As methods go, they took the town with the loss of 31 of their men .. earlier the same day British troops failed to take the town using conventional tactics at the cost of some 171 lives.

[1] https://anzac100.initiatives.qld.gov.au/remember/battle-of-b...

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Beersheba_(1917)

[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waler

There are no absolutes, are there? A pity the Australian light horse wasn't in the field during the great emu wars!

That being said, the Battle of Beersheba was a brilliant use of cavalery, because walking in close formation against entreched machine guns is just as stupid as charging an enemy in tight formation. Sometimes, there simply isn't a lot of choice, WW1 showed that problem every day.

Oddly enough there would have been a fair number of Beersheba survivors present.

The 1932 "Emu War" took place in the Campion region of Western Australia .. a town (and farming surrounds) cleared and created as Soldier Settlement lots and farms given to discharged veterans.

Never forget that the Coolgardie Miner (23 August 1935) reported that although the use of machine guns had been "criticised in many quarters, the method proved effective and saved what remained of the wheat" [1].

[1] https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/217998228?searchT...

Everybody tends to laugh at the Emu Wars, but nobody ever comes up with a better idea, myself included. Heck, we constantly fail to get rid of crows at certain places. Smart buggers, those crows... I do love them!

Well it was a successful tactic until things like better discipline, improved bayonet design and cannister shot came along:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highland_charge

Edit: I grew up quite close to Culloden and was shown the 1964 TV movie of the same name a few times at school.

No, it wasn't since days of the Phalanx. And propably way before that.

Sorry - I didn't mean that it was a generally a good idea just that in some contexts it did seem to work.

It is decent tactic against a breaking enemy. And when your troops keep some cohesion. The risk is, that the enemy doesn't break completely and you find yourself in loose formation, without cover and exposed, facing a tight enemy force.

If we're talking military tactics in media go to acoup.blog. It deconstructs a lot of movies/games. It's fun.

Totally agree! I think it was there that I saw the analysis of the orc's campaign, logistics and travel time, during the siege of Minas Thirith. Loved it!

A genuine smile shows in the eyes, which may be what many mammals pick up, as discussed a bit in the paper (cats and dogs certainly learn to associate the mouth shape with friendliness too). Bared teeth is a sign of aggression in many species though, smiling or not.

It seems as easy to fake a smile with the eyes as with the mouth, though?

Genuine → eyes famously does not imply eyes → genuine. But it does imply that ¬eyes → ¬genuine.

woah okay.

When I first learned English I was extremely confused that people kept referring to grinning as smiling, given that "smiling" refers to a wider range of expressions than just that. Smiling "with teeth" doesn't come to me naturally in the situations the word is typically associated with.

Given that the "American smile" is not universal (despite the changes in most cultures over the past centuries - there was an article posted on HN a few weeks ago about how AI generated "selfies" of people from certain cultures look wrong because they wouldn't smile like that), I wonder if the association between a toothy smile and friendliness is entirely recent, evolutionarily speaking.

I also wonder if the "don't smile at dogs because bared teeth are a sign of aggression" has more to do with dogs picking up on the mismatch between the "friendly" facial expression and the emotional state of the human or if they would be equally distressed when seeing a human genuinely grinning out of sheer overwhelming joy and happiness. I find exaggerated displays of friendliness as is common in US hospitality and retail extremely unnerving personally.

I can confirm this works with cats, it also seems to work on some dogs too

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