Comment by freedomben | Hacker News Reader

Comment by freedomben | Hacker News Reader

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It will certainly be interesting to see. Utah is an interesting case because generally speaking high percentages of the population will praise and promote "freedom" and "liberty." Of course with humans often stated/conscious beliefs and actions are often disjointed, but there's still an interesting angle there where the state is a lot more limited on what it can do in the enforcement arena before people start pushing back.

That said though, porn access in Utah would be a hard one for the average person to stand up for because the social pressure there is immense (speaking from experience here). The dominant religion teaches that "free agency" is an important and indeed essential aspect of our lives. We are here on Earth to grow and develop and learn to make good (i.e. obedient to God) choices. They even believe that a War in Heaven happened that split the masses because Satan (aka the Devil) wanted to force people to be righteous, but Jesus' plan was to give them choice. You would think they'd be a bunch of libertarians then, but no they clearly believe that God shouldn't force you to be righteous, but the state should. Furthermore God has told their prophets that things like alcohol, marijuana, porn, are wicked and sinful. Reducing or eliminating your access to them is for your own good (and the good of "society") and is therefore justified. I've tried pointing out that when it comes to enforcing your morals on others it can literally be taken to China-level authoritarianism with the same justication of "good for society," but that never seems to get anywhere.

For those who are wondering, none of these things are "banned" though.

Drive around Salt Lake County, especially the city itself, and you'll see plenty of bars, signs offering cannabis medical cards, and even a strip club here or there. And some not bad breweries.

The state just seems to take the approach of waiting for sufficient demand for such things, then slowly adjusting to allow more, rather that just "have at it" for anything.

And of course, like everything in America, what the government really follows is the money -- they listen to business community demands, like allowing and increased number of bars where tourism and the local population demands, like at ski resorts, etc. Agreed that porn could be different though, since there's probably not a local business group advocating for preserving porn access

Ok, now you have me thinking about local people that would stand to financially benefit from internet porn being banned. Along the lines of does a internet porn ban drive more people to visiting strip clubs, etc.

At pycon last week or so in Salt Lake City, I saw the bars are religious about scanning your id before you walk in. Every place that has a bar does it.

There's also restricted drink pours, and you must finish one drink before getting another. So like you can't order a double whiskey, nor can you order a regular martini -- although small ones are okay.

I can also directly attest to this. The kinds of restrictions that passed for normal in SLC would be laughable in NYC (or really any other city).

There’s also weird things about liquor licenses for “bars” in Utah. If you ever go back, ask any bar for their food menu and they’ll almost certainly bring one out. I’ve been told by a number of bartenders that only “restaurants” can get a liquor license (I’m sure that’s simplified). Then the culture of many such “restaurants” is indistinguishable from the culture of a bar.

The ID scanning is because of a local law, pretty blatantly intended to target ~bar~ “restaurant” hoppers, which was naturally only controversial with members of drinking culture. Sometimes I go to lunch at a local “bar” which has to scan my ID as soon as I walk in the door regardless of what I plan to order.

This comment makes me glad that most of my interactions with Mormons have been from the other side of the fence, so to speak. I grew up in SLC suburbs and currently live in South Salt Lake but I was Methodist growing up, never LDS. So there was never really anybody close to me who was Mormon except until the age by which they'd learned not to try to defend their beliefs to non-Mormons.

To this point: "porn access in Utah would be a hard one for the average person to stand up for". I suspect that the arguments will be for online privacy even if the real intention is for porn access. But it's kinda more like you said: it will certainly be interesting to see.

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