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Comment by colesantiago | Hacker News Reader

That is a shame.

Is there an alternative VPN provider that wouldn't be subject to this?

Huh? Why all the downvotes all of a sudden? this is a genuine question.

A VPN provider who wouldn't be subject to a search warrant? I suppose only one operating from a country where warrants aren't required for a search by police, but that would presumably be much worse.

What's happened here is the best way it could possibly go. A warrant was needed which meant prosecutors / police had to meet a certain bar to conduct a search, and when the search happened the data does not exist anyway. That's exactly what you want from a VPN. This isn't "a shame", it's cause of celebration that the process actually worked and the provider can clearly demonstrate that.

I guess the only alternative would be a country which passes a law saying that VPN data (or something including VPN data) could never be searched, but that's extremely unlikely of any country at the moment.

To a legal inquiry via search warrant? Probably not unless it's operated in a country that doesn't have search warrants, but that sounds more like a lawless wasteland.

Still waiting for someone to convert an international waters oil rig to a lawless data center. Or like that submarine base that Microsoft did.

You mean Sealand?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principality_of_Sealand

Your a bit more than 20 years late with the oil rig idea https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principality_of_Sealand

Governments can and will just criminalize the act of peering with them, so any ISP/transit provider will be liable if they peer. Problem solved.

You'd need every government to agree not to peer with them, otherwise you'd just route to whoever has agreed to peer. You might get shit latency, but it'd still work.

Getting everyone to agree not to peer seems like a rather tall order.

In case you hadn’t seen this story, which I believe fits a similar bill, here is the case of the Cyberbunker. This took place in the Netherlands.

Darknet Diaries has an (excellent, as always) episode about it. If it wasn’t that podcast it might have been Malicious Life.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2020/08/03/the-cold-war-b...

You might enjoy the book Cryptomnicon which is remarkably truthalized.

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/03/sealand-and-have...

> Huh? Why all the downvotes all of a sudden?

Because the whole point of the article is that there was no data to be compromised. If anything this should make you more likely to go with Mullvad if you're looking for VPN services.

Reading no more than the title, making up the article content in your mind, and writing a comment based on that made up content is a pretty good recipe for downvotes.

> Because the whole point of the article is that there was no data to be compromised.

AND they were able to convince the police and prosecutor of that!

I have to wonder what would have happened had the same thing occurred in the US. I'm really struggling to think of a scenario where the police have a warrant that says "$THING is on computers at this company, go get them" and you have literally any chance of convincing them that $THING is not anywhere.

I could see them taking all the computers then six months later saying "here you can have them back now, come pick them up at the precinct and here's the storage bill."

I would half expect them to sue the computers for obstruction of justice... and then just keep them.

I think you missed the entire point of the article.

I think one issue is, anyone who maybe could avoid the legal process would be located in the country and/or operate in a way …. where are you might not trust the business anyway.

Mullvad and how they operate seem to be the best choice for consumer vpn.

It will either be hosted in a country where they can access the data legally or will access it illegally. Pick your poison.

That's like asking whether someone can run a business without being subject to local laws and regulations.

None? Any VPN provider _will_ be subject to law enforcement in their jurisdiction.

No.

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