Court strikes down Berkeley’s ban on natural gas in new construction
sfchronicle.com
sfchronicle.com
But I hate that the elected officials here feel the need to get involved in issues beyond their scope.
Last week I was emailed by the city schools that they want to take the lead on… slavery reparations. What? Leave aside if reparations is right or not right, why the heck does the schoolboard think solving this problem is part of their job? It’s like deciding the school district will do ABI. It looks like resume building to me.
What permeates society is chronic histrionics.
Perhaps your elected officials are simply desperate. And given the severity of the situation, I wish more elected officials were many times more desperate than Berkeley’s.
This is the only power they have, and apparently the court has ruled they don’t even hold that power. You call it arrogance. I call a weak attempt while the system at large fails everybody, in other words, desperate is still my leading theory.
This includes irradiated food (e.g. many spices).
Exclusions. Nothing in this section shall be construed to prohibit the following:
4. Uses of radioactive material for smoke detectors, light emitting watches and clocks, and other applications not related to the development of nuclear weapons. (Ord. 5784-NS § 4, 1986)
At least for now, while natural gas is still being burned to make electricity.
If they actually cared about climate change they would focus on production. For example nuclear power.
Berkeley is not a small power producer. There are two power plants in the city, which ranks it kind of high on the list of California cities, particularly given the small size and population of Berkeley. Both power plants are natural gas. I was a fool defending these people, they obviously want to push the responsibility of ruining our climate onto consumers and away from governments.
IMO the much bigger issue with gas stoves is the hit in air quality. I have a CO2 and AQI meter I keep for measuring things and when we need to use the gas stove (we generally cook on induction) the difference in air quality is obvious both to our noses and to the meter and the air becomes appalling if we don't run the range hood. My partner and I have spent a lot of time in developing countries and just took the smell for granted until we started measuring the air quality.
California also tends to be very anti-nuclear which is also quite silly. Berkeley even moreso.
There's a backlog of ~1 terawatt in new generation, just waiting to be built.
We need permitting reform and to expand the grid.
Further, any place that jumps on the Green New Deal (or equiv) bandwagon will out complete the brave defenders of the status quo.
As Ben Shapiro likes to say: Mother Nature doesn't care about your feelings.
I find this idea absolutely bonkers when our electric infrastructure is terrible. The aerial power lines are subject to trees or large branches falling over and causing large power outages. Just this winter we had 4 major power outages, lasting from few hours to multiple days. Not only my city, the whole Silicon Valley had no power! The place supposedly having the brightest minds, trillion dollar companies, and the most advanced technology in the world! Not only we didn't have electricity, we had no Internet and cellular phones either. Absolutely insane!
Yeah, I do have solar power and battery backup, but during the winter relying on them does not always work. Luckily I had enough solar and battery generated electricity to power my natural gas furnace so I can have my house heated. The fan on the furnace uses 700W when pushing air, far less than electric heaters that would kill my Tesla batteries in a few short hours.
Why would anyone rely on a single source of energy, especially one that's so unreliable? Until we fix the electric grid, we shouldn't force everybody to switch to it.
A stove needs no power to run - you can light it with a match. And those appliances that need some electricity to help the natural gas can run off of a battery, or a tiny generator.
Natural gas is underground and virtually never has an outage.
https://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-pge-safety-investigat...
Beyond that leaks happen all the time, and explosions happen from time to time. I'm just gonna throw it out there, PG&E turns off gas service when there's a leak… causing… you know… an outage.
Oakland City Hall evacuated due to gas leak. 2014. https://w3.calema.ca.gov/mail/OperationsPortal.nsf/89f857187...
Car crash causes Oakland gas leak. 2021. https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/08/14/oakland-street-evacua...
Oakland gas explosion. 2010. https://6abc.com/archive/7828878/
Gas leak, explosion. San Francisco, 2007. https://www.mercurynews.com/2007/02/07/gas-leak-causes-explo...
Natural gas power plant explosion in Hayward. 2021. https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights...
Gas explosion, three alarm fire. San Francisco. 2019 https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/san-francisco-gas-...
Gas explosion and fire. Daly City, 2023. https://abc7news.com/daly-city-gas-line-fire-evacuations-lea...
Gas leak, evacuations. Sausalito 2022. https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/fire-units-respond-to-na...
Gas leak, evacuations. Antioch, 2023. https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/gas-leak-in-antioc...
Gas leak, evacuations. San Francisco, 2022. https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/evacuations-shelte...
Gas leak, evacuations. Menlo Park, 2022. https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/crash-menlo-park-s...
Gas leak, evacuations. Corte Madera, 2022. https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/corte-madera-gas-l...
Ruptured gas line, evacuations. San Francisco, 2022. https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/ruptured-gas-line-...
Gas leak, shelter-in-place. Emeryville, 2022. https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/emeryville-gas-lea...
Gas leak, evacuations. Morgan Hill, 2021 https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/firefighters-at-sc...
PG&E causes gas leak, evacuations. Daly City, 2012. https://www.mercurynews.com/2012/07/09/pge-worker-causes-lea...
Gas leak, evacuations. Daly City, 2019. https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/significant-gas-leak-p...
Gas leak. Daly City, 2017. https://patch.com/california/pacifica/gas-leak-fixed-nearby-...
Gas leak. Foster City, 2015. https://www.kron4.com/news/vehicle-crash-causes-gas-leak-in-...
Gas leak. San Francisco, 2016. https://www.kron4.com/news/crews-at-scene-of-gas-leak-in-san...
Besides the claim was "virtually never has an outage" not "virtually never has a widespread outage".
And im not talking the boonies. Im talking just outside San Francisco.
Gas is way more reliable than electricity in CA.
The thing with a power outage is that you'll sit around and enjoy having gas appliances. Whereas with a gas outage, you'll sit around and hope your house doesn't blow up.
And im not talking the boonies. Im talking just outside San Francisco.
Gas is way more reliable than electricity in CA.
https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-09-27/so-cal-g...
But anyways, how many people died from the wildfires started by power lines?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/07/22/pge-power-l...
But just pointing out gas and electric both cause them?
But anyways, how many people died from the wildfires started by power lines?
California's got a long history of safety problems with natural gas:
https://la.curbed.com/2016/3/8/11181374/gas-leaks-los-angele...
> On September 13, 2018, excessive pressure in natural gas lines owned by Columbia Gas of Massachusetts caused a series of explosions and fires to occur in as many as 40 homes, with over 80 individual fires, in the towns of Lawrence, Andover, and North Andover, all within the Merrimack Valley, in Massachusetts, United States. One person, Leonel Rondon, was killed and 30,000 were forced to evacuate their homes immediately.
One thing I learned around this time is in Massachusetts a number of wooden lines are in service and nobody knows exactly where they all are.
San Bruno bonfires for everyone.
To state the obvious, because if one or the other is out at least I have the other one.
That said, while electricity outages are pretty common here (California, thanks PG&E), natural gas has never had any kind of outage or problem.
So with gas I can still cook (gas range) when the electricity is out and I have hot water (gas water heater). I could even heat the house because the furnace fan doesn't require that much power so it can easily be powered by my small generator while all the heating BTUs come from the reliable natural gas line.
My biggest worry isn’t cooking, it’s refrigeration.
California's banning fuel powered generators in 2028 so do it while you can.
I'm honestly not trying to be a jerk, but it's really hard for me to understand why anyone would want to live like that.
The government there is just so... intrusive.
I lived in SoCal for six years in the 90s and absolutely loved it.
But now? I've lived all over the country, and experienced a lot of different state governments and local cultures.
I just don't think I could tolerate living in a state with that much regulation.
Does it ever bother you?
It's definitely gotten worse to live in these days (homeless, dumb politicians, rent, traffic, etc) but it's something I would put up with because it's truly a great location. I really wish someday someone competent would come to office there, but alas.
Not saying California is perfect, absolutely not. A shithole some might say, but there's so much Cali offers that you can't get anywhere else.
source: I'm from California, grew up SoCal, went to uni in NorCal. Went and seen it all. Unfortunately now I live in Seattle due to job reasons.
Bonus: we got hit by a 24 hour power outage in one of the storms and cooked solely using the Iwatani burner.
How are you calculating that? I highly doubt the total net environmental impact of butane canisters (including shipping and packaging) is lower than piped gas.
"Induction stoves with batteries built in, and why they matter. A conversation with Sam Calisch of Channing Street Copper Company and Wyatt Merrill of DOE." [Dec 2022] https://www.volts.wtf/p/induction-stoves-with-batteries-buil...
These types of appliances will quickly become the norm.
As opposed to a fairly standard 12gpm for a gas unit.
So … you’d have to either take a major step backwards and use a tank heater… or … maybe duplex two units in parallel…
FWIW, I looked into this because I wanted to use an electric option but it’s just not practical.
I'm all for getting rid of nat gas heating, and I wouldn't install it in a new home, but that doesn't mean that I believe that I would be protected from climate change because of it.
Does that also apply if your new house is in Alaska?
And of course I'm talking about a modern heat pump, not direct electric heating.
,,Heat pumps are generally more efficient than gas furnaces, but their efficiency may be affected by colder temperatures'' - Google search
The city's ban is largely aimed at changing the design specifications made by the developers. It has the benefit of preventing additional decades of lock-in and new development to infrastructure they'd like to remove anyway.
Until the last coal plant shuts down, it makes zero sense to ban natural gas.
https://www.energy.ca.gov/data-reports/energy-almanac/califo...
Berkeley has been transitioning businesses and residents to majority and most recently 100% renewable energy for years.
> Until the last coal plant shuts down, it makes zero sense to ban natural gas.
This is nonsense. Every year the % of renewable energy increases it makes more sense to electrify than it did previously. It's a lot easier to change the energy source for a power grid than it is to rip out all existing gas infrastructure.
I don't quite follow the logic here, why? California only had 1 coal plant left, and most of it has been decommissioned. It's not like natural gas usage would be replaced with coal. It would be replaced with either renewable, nuclear, or centralized natty
In some ways coal anywhere in the world counts because we tend to sell unused coal (i.e. any coal not burned by us just gets burned elsewhere).
I suspect when California finishes shutting down the last coal plant, it'll probably be with local unused natural gas capacity or renewable. I don't think it's practical for the state to import coal power from separate grids or across the country. I know reducing coal usage in the US might make it cheaper to burn in coal in other parts of the world, but there's still local benefits wrt lifespan and air quality
I do like cooking with a flame though, even though it's terrible for indoor air quality.
Whether you can run two kettles depends on the age of the house (i.e. which version of the electric code it was built to) and which outlets you choose. If you want to draw a full 3000W the way a quick European kettle does, you can't do that on a single 15 or 20 amp American branch circuit. Now it is possible to mildly overload breakers for a period of time without tripping them, but this hardly a good recommendation.
If you want 3000w of electricity in an American house, just buy an 240v appliance.
Whatever. My kettle is rated at 1500 watts and it's still quite a bit faster than the shitty gas range. And it'll keep water at temp for half an hour. And it's adjustable so I can boil water or heat it up for whatever tea or coffee. There's a pretty strong convenience factor here.
A 240 V kettle is probably not worth the hassle though, especially not if you want your local building inspector to sign off on anything.
Additionally, the main impacts on climate change from natural gas don't come from peoples homes or lateral lines, which is what a lot of these bans are based on. [1] [2]
1: https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/natural-gas/natural-gas-...
2: https://www.eia.gov/totalenergy/data/monthly/pdf/flow/CO2-sp...
Fossil fuel usage is vastly more expensive when the externalities are accounted for. This is like saying it's more financially responsible to just put everything on credit cards and ignore the ever-growing balance statements.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1287660/california-elect...
The word "renewable" gets thrown around a lot to the point where you forget what it means. But it means a resource that you can renew: It doesn't run out, you don't need to depend on others, and best of all it doesn't need to be bought from a crazed homicidal neighboring nation.
There are certainly lots of right-now problems to solve in Berkeley, including at the operations of the City of Berkeley, and yet council can find time for a foreign policy agenda, a climate change agenda, a human rights agenda, etc.
How about a fourth kind of garbage bin? Maybe a purple one for waste that has bad vibes. Bad vibes are the third leading cause of harshed mellows in the US.
Particularly since we’ve been in a climate emergency for a few years now. In fact I think Berkeley was one of the first cities to declare one. How is electrifying households a disaster but emitting more green house gasses isn’t?
The way things are shaping up, it's going to be the countries who have to import all their fossil fuels who will be the most interested in developing renewable energy as a replacement for fossil fuels.
It's not exactly rocket science, is it?
Kind of. It was the California Restaurant Association that brought the case.
https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/cvx/holders?ltr=1
Oh interesting, Warren Buffett's Berkshire Hathaway is now Chevron's top holder. Who do you think appoints the judges?
https://ei.marketwatch.com/Multimedia/2017/03/13/Photos/ZH/M...
Sounds like they already have something to encourage heat pumps; you don't have to put in venting for heat pumps, and they don't want to deal with it. Problem solved. You should really have a proper range vent regardless of the heat source, but I guess that's not mandated, so there you go.
The reason for Europe's natural gas demand at the moment is because the EU has this minor dispute with that other large supplier of natural gas: Russia.
Lesson learned: Don't depend on resources that can run out or be denied to you.
Right now there are literally simply not enough craftsmen around able to rip out/replace/supplement (my corner of) Europe's natural gas heating systems fast enough. The waiting lists are insane.
This means that the EU is stuck having to import natural gas as an interim emergency measure. But ask any county in northwest Europe and I bet they'd tell you that Berkeley is doing the sane thing here.
No. I think you must have misread something.
In my previous post, I am strongly implying that Russian gas is not going to start flowing again anytime soon, if ever.
> In any case, the global harm that's come from building a multi-decade dependence on Russia for anything as crucial as oil and gas is far worse than the harm coming from some gas stoves
The use of large numbers of gas stoves (and gas ovens, and gas central heating) is what leads to this kind of dependency in the first place.
> European powers don't get to comment on sanity in this debate.
I'm talking about all the counties (villages, towns, cities) large and small, who have been working hard to help their local home-owners and renters get through this winter and beyond.