That “Dreaded” Commute Is Good for Your Health | Hacker News Reader

That “Dreaded” Commute Is Good for Your Health

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8 pointssublinear38 comments

What an utter load of shit.

You know what's good for me? Having an extra fifteen hours a week, where I'm not trapped in bumper-to-bumper traffic, breathing in smog.

Taking a walk around my neighborhood with my wife and dogs in the afternoon, instead of running to McDonalds to cram some calories down my throat so I can go back to work.

Driving to the gym, instead of driving to the office.

Those things are good for me. My commute was killing me. If something hadn't changed, I fully believe that commuting in Boston traffic would have shaved years off my life.

Fuck this "back to the office" nonsense.

Bumper to bumper is horrible. But as described in my response, shifting a timetable could drastically change a commute experience.

A lot of people have a lot of things they can't shift around, like children, and circadian rhythms.

"Return to the office" brought to you by the people who have a bunch of money tied up in the commercial real estate market

This guy is full of shit. Walking around your block at home is healthier. Having lunch at home with your dog is healthier. Not being stuck in a train with hundreds or a car with pollution is healthier. Almost like he was paid to write this.

If a person works from home they have to actively choose to do the walk around their block. A person who has to walk to go to work doesn’t have to actively choose to go for a walk. Americans don’t walk much and many people simply don’t walk unless they have to.

I was on vacation recently on an island that has a mix of people who stay in resorts and drink, people who do adventury type stuff and are active, and cruise people who are dropped off from a giant one and spend the day walking around.

This last category waddle around and breathe heavily like they walk once or twice a year. Their walk is so strange, from behind they wave their arms like a paddle in water.

We often talk about obesity as some sort of thing that happens to people. I really wish willpower and individual will could come back as a value in American society. We don't have to go back to the 80s. But we need to start holding individuals accountable, it will make them feel more like they have control.

I commute multiple times a week and I also didn't commute at all for a while. I stayed fit because I do a variety of exercises, I do it like a quota of What Must Be Done, and I've married obligation with fun (which means picking and choosing). Sometimes I eat too much so I'll eat less the next day. Most days I skip breakfast because I know my body doesn't need 2500 calories a day.

It's an individual choice, not A Thing That Happens To people.

I don’t believe it is correct to lay the blame at the individual level. American society has evolved into a country where people, for the most part, spend their lives indoors and only go outside to get into a car to drive themself to another building. Our food has been engineered to co-opt our natural satiety instincts. Our food has been engineered to be addictive. As a species humans are local optimization machines that seek to optimize convenience. Simply put, with advertising and the way society has evolved we don’t stand a chance except for the people with exceptional will power.

One can not be hyper vigilant at all times and exercise willpower. We simply aren’t capable of that.

That's as fatalistic as it is false. Why do you have to be hyper vigilant? I live in surroundings where physical activity is the norm rather than the exception. True. BUT. While suburbanites are often couch to car and back, you can drive to a gym, a park to go biking, a hiking spot, a climbing wall, thousands of other things. A tennis court, an indoor pool, a kayaking spot. You can take lessons with a group, you can do a little something in your home. You can take yoga classes.

You're telling me how it's not possible and I've just told you why it is. The majority of people struggling with inactivity are suffering from a motivational problem or an educational problem.

How society is constructed, how our food supply has co-opted our satiety instincts, how advertising works and how social media and other dopamine inducing passive activities have co-opted our brains and willpower play no role in your Ayn Randian fantasy world where each person can just exercise willpower to combat these ills. You are wrong and the evidence is quite clear. Humans did not suddenly lose willpower in the last few decades. Most rich nations have seen a rise in obesity with Americans leading the way. Loneliness is on the rise and while you personally are immune to the aforementioned ills most people aren’t.

Dark patterns work because we aren’t always vigilant. For instance, Google knows we don’t always read the instructions perfectly and we are easily duped, statistically speaking, to do things that we didn’t mean to do. There are dark patterns so to speak in the way our society is constructed.

I like your general sentiment and I live my life the same way, but I think it’s hard to change someone’s behavior from childhood, especially if they have been raised in a nutritional environment more fit for veal than human beings. Really hard to get people to change habits.

Hard, absolutely. But again people who don't do hard things.. I can only be dismissive. I've done hard things much of my life and that meant suffering for a time. Those who avoid hard things get what they deserve.

The “I did it, therefore anyone can” line of reasoning is overly simplistic and entirely unhelpful when looking for solutions. I don’t have a predilection for alcohol and will never be an alcoholic. I don’t say to the drunkard, “Just stop drinking.” That is foolishness to think it works.

I agree that people need to eat well and do exercise, but at the same time society needs to be built in a way that makes this easy to do. I live in one of the few walkable places in the US. In some rankings it is considered the fittest place in the US. It is not a coincidence. Yes there are still overweight people here, and fit people in very un-walkable areas. But in terms of population stats better environments lead to healthier people.

At the same time I agree that for the individual they need a mindset that they can change their circumstances. The US won't be made walkable over night if ever. There is unlikely to be a ban on producing or advertising high sugary processed food. But even in such an environment you still have tons of agency over your choices.

I absolutely agree! Freedom of choice has the largest influence on a person's health from all work related circumstances.

A normal American commute entails like a thousand feet of walking. House to car, car to seat, and reverse.

To be honest, I wouldn't mind in-office work if I could walk it.

As long as the walk isn't along super polluted roads, or litter-filled streets.

I agree. Our society needs an overhaul. It is unhealthy in many respects.

No, yeah, I love enduring non-billable time in traffic, away form my family. It's so healthy; I get great cardio from all of that bottled up rage.

I don’t think he’s completely full of shit, just mostly. I personally find a whole bunch of good behaviors naturally occur and I feel mentally more healthy if I’m forced to go to the office. I get up earlier, go to bed earlier, feel a stronger sense of work/life disconnection, and have a better sense of the passage of time. I’ve worked remote for years and have tried to replicate this, but it’s never the same. But I’m not a parent, so that changes the trade off quite a bit

During covid, I got laid off from my job as a graphic designer. I spent the next year on a web dev course, fully remote, but with regular virtual meetings with 'classmates' and tutors (once a week), and Discord groups for chatting via text/asking for help.

I then got a web dev job, which turned out to be full-time in-office. I adjusted, but I resented, and still resent, being in the office. It's not for me. I don't have my kitchen, I don't have my expensive office chair, I don't have my good keyboard and mouse, I don't have my comfortable living room for when I'm on my lunch breaks, I find I get significantly worse sleep, and the commute stresses me out a ton (as well as costing an absolute fortune).

It's definitely a problem that divides people, with some firmly on the in-office side and others wanting to be at home. Businesses really should be catering for both.

Agreed - the issue is the false dichotomy implied by suggesting that commuting itself is the answer. I think that it would be much more honest to opine that DESPITE the tolls on our health and time, in-office work provided a social and personal structure that had its benefits, and that many people struggle to replicate those structures in their newly-isolated personal lives.

It's not like commuting is hard-coded into our DNA. Over the past 60ish years commuting slowly changed a lot of things about modern life, and taking it away suddenly revealed a lot of those. But that doesn't mean that commuting is, itself, the answer to our social or motivational desires.

Behind the clickbait headline is a simple conflation of something that's net bad (commuting) with its one redeeming factor (change of environment). Here's the implicit argument:

1. We thought commutes were bad because all the studies say so.

2. But actually, our mental health got worse when the pandemic kept us cooped up inside.

3. So bring back the commute!

The sensible inference here would be that the commute is bad, but being stuck alone in the same place with no breaks staring at Zoom all day is worse. If so, then the ideal scenario would be one of the following:

- Office with minimal commute

- Home office with regular breaks, walks, outside exposure, human interaction

Of course, since this point would be both obvious and correct, it would not be publishable; instead we have provocative and wrong.

As a former super commuter (90min to 3hrs one direction), I enjoyed aspects of the structure: the forcing feature of public transit made sure I got to and out of the gym before work, and I would get to listen to audiobooks when not working on the train.

However, the forcing feature has major drawbacks that can be made up in other ways. The scales are so tipped against commuting that you have to do mental gymnastics to justify it. More and more, I realize we need walkable cities and walkable commutes.

Walking 1 hour round trip to work was the sweet spot for me. Exercise, easy to go to the gym either side, listened to podcasts, had a mental transition to and from work, and walking is fine in basically any weather or season.

Now I work from home and it's nice but it has a whole set of mental challenges. I'd go back to walking if I could stand being in the office.

So rituals are good. Not commuting. Commuting is actually BAD for your health..the article even literally says so in the beginning and backs it up with statistics..

I can accept this if you have a walk to work. Ice in the spring and fall, ok in the summer. Winter, though, can be harsh in some spots. If a car or bus or train is involved, particularly if it’s the principal component, then no. Such activities aren’t exercise. Stress-inducing, maybe, but not exercise.

If we care about the environment, jobs that can be done “locally” should be done locally. Having to burn energy commuting isn’t a positive contribution.

Crock of shit. My commute:

- Steals 10 hours of my time every week. I could spend 10 extra hours with my family, get better sleep, or actually have time for the gym

- Costs me thousands a year. Money wouldn't be so tight if I had the £200 extra a month my commute costs me.

- Causes ridiculous stress with all the dumbshits on the roads

- Force me to spend 2 hours a day in a car surrounded by other polluting vehicles

- Means I have no access to my kitchen to cook fresh, healthy meals without worrying about having to transport them to work/heat them up in gross microwaves

- Means that I can't make the most of my solar panels, which give me free electricity... during the hours I'm at work.

Siting in my car for 2 hours a day, getting increasingly stressed, is absolutely not good for my mind and body. Especially when I know I could be sat at home, in a relaxing environment, with all the comforts of home.

As someone who lives in the United States, I'm skeptical and fearful of their claims.

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keeling_Curve

* https://abc7ny.com/tag/subway-crime/

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_New_York_City_Subway_atta...

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Nia_Wilson

* https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/tag/freeway-shooting/

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Oscar_Grant

Sounds more like a devil's advocate writing prompt than an argument a sane human would try and make

I drive 181km single journey every week, stay one or two nights and return. As traffic can be challenging, I leave at 05:00 to arrive at 07:00 whereas leaving at 07:00 would add an hour and a half to my commute. When I return, I grab dinner and leave around 18:00, again bypassing rush hours. When driving, I listen to podcasts, not radio, only podcasts. They bring me knowledge and insight. My job at 181km away is awesome, it is not possible to get an equally challenging and satisfying job closer to home. Yes, my commutes are absolutely having a positive impact on my health.

Given that this remote work boom happened in response to a *pandemic*, this seems to be ignoring the elephant in the room. In the US, you can add an extremely unhealthy political climate egged on by a major media network openly supporting lies. And, incredibly spiking rental rates. How you can blame remote work on mental health while ignoring these major impacts just seems... like these writers are living in some weird bubble.

Unreal delusion and/or out of touch.

"You are commuters. For the day, week, year, or decade, you are bonded by a common struggle. That brings you closer. That makes you better colleagues. That alloys you in social contract."

You'll suffer, but you'll all suffer together, so that's good.

https://www.keckmedicine.org/blog/commuting-and-your-health/

That's an ad. Corporate real estate is really getting desperate.

We can only hope it continues. As corporate office space gets converted to other purposes, it will be a more expensive lift in the future to bring more space online, hopefully destroying demand.

I can smell the desperation.

> Now, go enjoy your trip.

Is that an order? My answer is no either way.

Propaganda

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