Hacker News Reader

Comment by gavingmiller | Hacker News Reader

Ultimately it's your fault as a contractor if you don't get paid. And a site like this does nothing to teach developers, freelances, designers, and the like how to avoid these pitfalls which is why I'll never use it.

Why is it your fault? Because as a professional you've not taken the time/money to have a contract created to cover your ass. Contracts exist to protect both parties from each other. And it is your professional duty to know what's in your contract (not a piece meal that you dug up on the internet.) You should be able to explain to your clients what is in your contract, why it's there, and how it benefits them and you.

View on HN

Didn't he have a contract which he used to successfully sue the client with? It didn't seem to make any difference.

At the same time I am uneasy with this sort of one-sided public exposure, doesn't feel very professional even if true, and of course without knowing the facts of the matter we don't know whether it is in fact true.

>Ultimately it's your fault as a contractor if you don't get paid.

Um.. what? It looks like, judging by the first story on the page, there was a contract which he successfully sued the delinquent client with, and it's just taking forever to collect.

It's not your fault that the judicial system is an inefficient mess and that people lie.

Contract are only really usefull for big company and with big accounts.

For private freelancers and small/medium jobs suing someone for breach of contract will probably not be a viable option.

The amount of time, effort and money that you need to sue someone and win sometimes is seample not feasible.

Yes, having a contract written by a laywer may work as a deterrent for some clients. But if they don't accept you still need to file a lawsuit.

And there is also the problem that sometimes they simple can't pay. They look and act like they have all the money in the world, but they are actually betting all they have in a website because "making a website is easy and I will make millions with my great idea".

Then even if you win they are simply going bankrupt and you will never see nor your money nor the ones that you spent on lawyers.

It is foolish to do "contract work" with no contract, period.

The other key deterrent is to keep a handle on your deliverables until the client pays you. That does not mean "kill switch" in an app running on someone else's servers, it means (whenever possible) don't put the deliverables on someone else's servers until they pay you.

If the work depends on their pre-existing code or assets, get the dependencies into your private and properly secured development environment (with a tightly scoped license and NDA to protect the client).

And make sure your contract says that until they pay you, everything you create is your property. You can't claw fees out of a bankrupt client, but you can at least keep exclusive rights to your work.

"Contracts are only really useful for big company and with big accounts."

This is totally untrue, and incorrect. Not only because you can take even a tiny client to small claims court (but without a written contract, forget it) but because contracts are also there to protect YOU from claims by a client against you and your business. If you believe that your business is valuable, or you have any personal assets you'd hate to lose to a lawsuit, you should be using a written contract any time you're doing work for hire as a contractor.

It seems that contracts are assumed. These are truly delinquent clients that attempt to weasel out of the contract any way they can.

One time, we had a client stiff us for $50,000, contract and all. We delivered a bunch of back-end work and he disappeared. We've never been able to find him.

The stories I read on the site mentioned contracts, and people still refused to pay, causing the contractors to have to go to court, get a ruling in their favor, and then get the sheriff to go and collect - and that's assuming they have any money or assets left to collect.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com