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Comment by paganel | Hacker News Reader

> As winter ends, Russia has lost this phase of the conflict

Russia is losing "phase" after "phase" of the conflict until all the Ukrainian cemeteries will be filled with men aged 20 to 65. I hate Atlanticist propaganda.

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Is there a contradiction somewhere? Everyone, not least every Ukrainian, knows the prize of the defeat of Russia will be a large part of a generation of Ukrainian men and women.

That doesn't make it "not a defeat" for Russia unless the initial ambitions of Russia are achieved (And let's face it, they won't be). It's a very expensive victory for Ukraine and an even more expensive defeat for Russia.

You don't have to be an `Atlanticist` to see how bad things are for Russia in term of what they expected vs what they got, in fact even inside Russia many (pro war) voices criticise the pace and results of most operations.

They lost insane amount of men and equipment and aren't anywhere close to their initial objective, and they seem to struggle much more than Ukrainians in term of replenishing ammo and equipment

They're not losing the war but they're clearly struggling much more than they ever expected

Russia lost 20 million men(!!!!) In WW2 and yet it was still a victory. Ukraine can and will win this conflict, but of course the cost will be a massive amount of deaths on their end.

Russia lost 13 million people in WW2. The rest of the 27 million were other Soviet republics, disproportionately including Ukraine and Belarus.

You are of course correct. The official figure of 27 million is given for all of Soviet Union. My bad.

The price of russian defeat is terrible, but does not compare to the price of russian victory that we have seen in Bucha and Mariupol.

Russian shills are pathetic people.

I hate russian trolls

"Atlanticist propaganda" is when you don't bow down to Putin's tiny feet

What else do you expect? Hollywood told us we can't loose so I guess it should be that. It's all cope after cope after cope, poor Ukrainian men dragged by force are the ones paying for Zelensky next round of fundings.

If Russia seizes control of the entire territory they will still put out pieces about how Russia lost.

It's not very convincing to portray an obvious lose-lose scenario as a win for anyone. What can be said is that Russia so far has not reached any of its political and military objectives. So far, the Russian aggressors have even failed to capture a relatively unimportant town of 70,000 inhabitants as part of an allegedly large offensive.

I'm right there with you

It's true that Ukrainians winning for almost a year they should be at the gates of Moscow now, no? That's what I would think if newspapers in my country (France) were to be believed.

if you somehow disagree and point out the other narrative, you are a putin Chill.. Pathetic how the orange website is not safe from trolls.

They aren't trying to invade Russia. They are trying to defend their sovereign country against Russian aggression. Russia is showing the world how incompetent their military is at the same time Ukraine is successfully defending their homeland. Putin is a pathetic joke. He can't even keep the mercenaries from disparaging his weak military.

Ukraine will never be "at the gates of Moscow" because they aren't trying to invade Russia.

Crimea is, for all intents and purposes, Russia, and Ukraine has never ceased promising an invasion to bring it "back home".

Basically the whole world disagrees and considers Crimea to be Ukrainian. Including China, for example.

It's not their business - Crimea is Russian domestic affair now and the opinion of the whole world is irrelevant. Much like the opinion of the whole world of what happens in Guantanamo or Xinjiang is safely ignored. Except that people are not in any death camps in Crimea but actual resort camps such as Artek.

Crimea and Donbas had been a domestic affair of Ukraine before 2014, but Russia ignored that out of position of power.

This issue will be in the end again decided by power.

That's why Russia has to secure and hold on to all those additional lands to avoid war coming to its core turf.

That's been their excuse for most of their past invasions. Russia did not feel secure enough with East Germany, I guess it won't end until Portugal is secured.

Anyway, I think the chance that Ukraine would continue beyond their internationally recognized borders is close to zero.

That's Europe for you, everybody invading everybody else all the time.

I'm not even sure what is their chance of regaining anything at all.

European countries stopped invading each other after WW2 (most of the exceptions committed by SU/Russia).

Who knows how this will end up, it's still very open. In WW1, Russia collapsed after about 3 years of war, in Afghanistan it took them about 10 years to retreat (and subsequently collapse).

What about WW2 kind of ending?

Russia occupying Berlin is pretty much impossible.

Russia occupying Kyiv is possible, but rather unlikely. I think it's less likely than a Russian collapse.

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