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Comment by Overtonwindow | Hacker News Reader

I think over time, maybe in just a year or two, westerners will reach tip burnout. It may not grow to have people choosing not to go out because of tipping, but I think it will have an effect where people become numb to tipping. They will tip the barest minimum, have no guilt about hitting zero at the coffee shop, etc.

Essentially tipflation will cause tip requests to lose any moral obligation. Kind of like when the grocery store asks you to donate $1 to St. Judge. If you press Yes, great! Thank you, but I suspect many of us automatically press no without another thought.

That no without thought will be how people tip in the future...

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I’ve been there for a while. It’s getting out of hand, and has been since COVID.

During COVID I felt good about tipping because small businesses and restaurants were struggling, so it felt like I was doing something positive.

But then businesses got greedy, not only did they increase the prices (+50-100%) in some cases, but also increased the pre-programmed tipping percentages. Pre COVID used to be (12,15,20), now it is more like (18,22,25).

With the increase in prices I would actually tipping more $ even if they kept the percentages the same.

But it’s the greed of increasing percentages that is getting out of hand.

And also where tips are expected. Getting a drip coffee, a place where they just hand you the cup but you pour it yourself asked for a tip. What exactly did you do as a server in this case?

Getting an ice cream … you scooped it up and handed it to me. That’s your job, I am not sure what you did beyond your job description to get a tip.

I’m at the point where I just hit no tip out of spite for places that I don’t think deserve to have a tipping option to start with.

Restaurants, haircuts and bars are fair game, but I still think service has to be above par for more than 15% tip.

There's "ok we'll tip" areas that people expect (sit-down restaurant, bar, delivery) but the proliferation of "tablet payments" that default to having a tip section is out of control. And the middle-ground of "do I tip for pickup?" which society hasn't really nailed down yet, too.

I don't forsee the US going entirely tip-free, but the number of places you tip could certainly decline (nobody tips at McDonalds, and few tip at Dominos for pickup, even though you can).

Maybe the IRS could do something to making receiving income via tips tax disadvantaged (and loudly, publicly) so that alternate methods would work. I do know a number of tip-employees who would hate that; they make quite good money on tips.

> Maybe the IRS could do something to making receiving income via tips tax disadvantaged (and loudly, publicly)

Tips should be treated as income to the business if the business collects it, because that's exactly what it is.

Yeah, this would suck for workers who rely on tips. But the blame for this lies with business leaders; they are the ones who have chosen to abuse this loophole for personal gain.

I've already reached tip burnout. I used to be a great supporter of tipped positions and would tip generously, but it's all gotten so out of control. I now just refuse to tip at all, except in restaurants where I've scaled back to 10%. And even that irritates me anymore.

I’m heading in this direction too. It’s ridiculous. I don’t tip for any kind of pickup order. And only tip service people such as waiters, bar staff, and delivery people.

Serious question - why are you punishing waitstaff because everyone post-COVID has decided they deserve tips for everything? That has nothing to do with them.

My wife thinks I'm pretty stingy on non-restaurant tipping. I won't tip for pickup, online orders, the type of thing mentioned here. But that doesn't mean a server at a restaurant suddenly did a worse job or deserves a 40-50% pay cut. My default is 20% and I can count on one hand the number of times in the last year or so I've gone under that, and many times have gone over. 10% is borderline "something happened where I need to talk to a manager" territory.

It's a compromise position. My intention is not to punish the wait staff, but the tipping status quo needs also needs to change, and how else will that change happen other than by resisting the status quo? So I tip the wait staff, but now I tip the traditional amount rather than the "enhanced" rates. I figure that it's better than just not tipping at all, or not going to the restaurant (when the wait staff would get nothing).

What actually needs to happen is that businesses need to start paying their employees a realistic wage and building that into the prices they charge. There are a couple of restaurants in town that do this and don't allow tipping. I preferentially eat at those.

But don't get me wrong here -- I'm talking about default tipping. If I actually get above-average service, even in settings outside of restaurants, I'll tip more.

Also, I never tip on the card. Always cash.

> 10% is borderline "something happened where I need to talk to a manager" territory

I believe that's the problem being discussed :)

> I think over time, maybe in just a year or two, westerners will reach tip burnout.

I think it can last much longer. As a European I already don't understand it and I feel you should have reached tip burnout ten years ago. But the culture hasn't changed it went worse. The dark patterns must be working.

Tipping is spreading means more and more people are at the receiving end of it and depend on it, these people aren't going to complain about it.

>> It may not grow to have people choosing not to go out because of tipping.

It did for me personally. It was a huge motivator in learning to cook at home.

This is a future vision I can get behind.

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