The Absurdity of Income Tax
treeofwoe.substack.com
treeofwoe.substack.com
What nonsense. The writer assumes that the final goal of the goverment is to increase revenue. That is how corporations work, not governments. The goal of government is to represent its citizens to try to achieve the society that citizens want. The goal is to maximize well-being (whatever is each person definition), not cash.
From there on, everything falls into this kind of missing the point arguments.
Unfortunately, many strong men governments around he world have rigged their elections and/or face weak enough oppositions that they have been in power for way too long, in which case this does indeed become a possibility.
> Most governments don’t remain in power for more than a few years. They are constantly changing. Which prevents what you’re suggesting from happening.
Over 4 million people are employed by the US Government, with the number being elected to those positions only in the hundreds, and those appointed numbering a few thousand. The reality is there is very little turnover in the government. > The goal of government is to represent its citizens to try to achieve the society that citizens want.
This is something we tell ourselves even though we know it isn't true. Take something like the Iraq War, which had abysmal support for many years yet continued on for no good reason. Or what percentage of our CIA operations would the general public feel represents their interests? And how many billions of taxpayer money is wasted on special interests that only a tiny fraction of people care about?There are groups who believe that the tax system should encourage certain objectives. Which specific group has power keeps changing (a much deeper trend than mere political parties). The tax system is a jumble of competing ideas. Sometimes, if something is grossly unfair, the rules change. Other times they don't.
If we applied the same philosophy to land, we'd need much fewer "arbitrary" tax types and percentages.
Our tax systems are indeed deeply flawed and arguing that any system is arbitrary and equally absurd/paradoxical/inefficient is incorrect since there are examples of ethical (and I would argue necessary) taxes.
We can swap the Income Tax for an Air Tax if that helps, air is a resource. Charge by lung capacity. Big fellas do tend to make more money so it'd probably be a rough proxy for wealth and class I expect.
Resource taxes:
* Disincentive producing resources.
* Are still arbitrary.
Fundamentally what a tax is recognising is that Entity A did the work, but Entity B should decide who gets the fruit of that work. There is no acknowledgement that Entity A might be better than B at deciding what to do, or mechanism to test it, or even really a jury to decide it in practice (in theory the legislators could, but frankly I don't think any of the legislative bodies I'm aware of could tackle that sort of micromanagement). We don't even have consensus on what value system we should use to decide which entity was going to make a better decision even if we have perfect information about both hypothetical resource allocations. It is all ultimately arbitrary.
Even the no-tax pure free market solution is arbitrary, the argument in favour of it is it has the incentive structure that results in the most production, and big picture history suggests that maximising production will get best overall living standards. But it is clearly arbitrary, people love to point out the wild wealth differences between people who seem pretty similar except for minor differences.
These are not academic or theoretical concerns, this stuff is the meat of most of the big political debates that rage on.
Which takes us to the barter part of the essay.
There is a major difference between paying someone to do your chores or doing them yourself. What's the difference? The value you are willing to exchange not to do the chores yourself, of course. Be it lack of skills, lack of time or valuing that time spent doing something else more than what you're giving in exchange.
In other words: the IRS recognizes that you own your own time and are free to do with what you want, but when you exchange it for something of value - money, services, goods - you will be taxed on that value.
Not entering the discussion on taxes: both the lawn mowing person and the house cleaning person recognize that there is more value in the other's time for a given task than their own time, if and how much that differential in value should be taxed it's a different conversation.
We are not aware of non-hypothetical long-term widespread high standard of living completely non-capitalist societies (yes, that's a bunch of qualifiers), but there is certainly a range of taxation, legal and social policies that work to varying degrees of success.
I've never liked the idea that we would devolve into chaos if our government wasn't there keeping us all in line. It assumes that a) there are some people who know what is best for all of us and b) that we're effectively signing up to live as animals in a zoo.
Don't get me wrong this isn't some anarchist dream, I don't want to find out what happens without a government. But I can't sign up for the idea that a government and its taxes are a fundamental requirement for any form of civilized society.
But that's not how the world works, and you will often deal with people from which you cannot know how trustworthy they are. Nothing stops a gang of thugs from outside to come steal and kill without repercussions.
There's some good research being done in regards to prisons in Calofirnia. And how an increase in prisoners has cause a massive deterioration in social conduct.
Maybe the question doesn't matter now that this is where we're at, but at best I think it's be safe to say government taxes are necessary for the civilized society we have today.
Still leaving out one major part: the willingness of some other entity to trade your input for money at a mutually agreeable rate. You can be willing to trade 55 hours a week of high-quality work for $3 million a year and not find an employer.
Regardless, I found the anecdotes entertaining.
It seems that once you get into the world of macroeconomics, everything is absurd in some way or other. It's all just a great weird fiction that we all buy into because it keeps society running. Money itself is a weird social construct. GDP is completely mad.
What does the author suggest we do instead? Something that isn't as absurd?
The way I think a out the barter rules is that they are there to keep people from using barter terms to describe non-barter economic activity. In other words, if someone lives their entire life avoiding cash or instruments of cash, but trades units of work for goods to deliberately avoid income taxes, the rules allow the IRS to say nope, we see through you, you're putting in 32+ hours and getting what other people pay roughly $50k/year for, so what you really have is a full-time $50k job, and you owe taxes based on that.
A world without such rules might be a world in which many, many more people "barter" time for goods and services in just that way.
By penalising those who work hard, it destroys social mobility and entrenches the establishment landowners and conservatism.
Income tax and VAT should be replaced with wealth tax, Land Value tax, property tax, inheritance tax, gift tax, etc. - i.e. tax the accumulation of wealth itself and use that to help level the playing field and promote economic activity (startups, technological disruption, etc.).
Ideal time to tax.
If you suggest something like a land value tax then people will worry about how you value something without a market price. It is in some senses abitrary what your land is worth (Not actually a problem in practice but makes the point why a hacky system might prevail in the real world).
See also, taxes on purchases, estate taxes etc.
The correct amount stabilizes a system. Too much kills it; too little lets the system self-immolate.
I was actually thinking of an AskHN just ahead of seeing this item: "Why aren't all the Really Smart People in tech demanding serious tax reform?"
VAT is regressive without some kind of subsidy or UBI.
For people who actually make $10 million per year, and do not pay much in VAT, there are still better ways to tax them than the income tax (which they can avoid with some tax optimization scheme), like property taxes, or capital gain tax.
But it means a lot to some of my friends with minimal wage.
As long as the rich dude is investing it in businesses and things that push the economy forward, I see no issue with it. And of course that rich dude one day is going to wanna buy the Lambo, boats, and boob jobs for the girlfriend … and that’s when we tax him.
And by the way you’d be shocked at how much is rich people spend. I literally know guys making 10 million a year, with virtually no savings.
The first person might pay more in absolute terms, but that doesn't sound fair to me.
Let’s take another example. Two middle-class households with exactly the same income. One household, is putting every cent they can towards a 529 plan for their kids college education. Any left over goes towards retirement. The second household, spends every dollar they have on luxury items and toys.
Why should both households be taxed at the exact same rate?
"People who have more than they need to live are greedy and need to have their money taken and given to those who do not."
^ That is the most fair way to tax.
Make below X based on last year’s tax return? Here’s a quarterly cheque to offset the average individual’s sales tax.
So if price was a barrier before, it will still be a barrier afterwards unless you can afford to loan your money out to the government for 3 months
2) on top of taxes paid by people who are part of a corporation, corporations pay a lot of other taxes. E.g. taxes on commercial vehicles, commercial real estate and lots of other special taxes depending on jurisdiction.
It does sound like a great way to increase consumption and short term GDP growth...
Different people have different consumption patterns. Corporations are incentivized to maximize profit (shareholders want a return), individuals are not...
Some people are. I don't think that applies to the majority of people who can afford to save though.
> the enforcement of saving could be offloaded to the government
Yes, let's also abolish private property. That sure worked out great...
Debt grants its users a taste of what they can not yet afford, subsequently reinforcing the notion that work is equal to progress while also ensuring continuous participation within the larger financial system.
Taxes guarantee the debt-free still participate in commerce. One cannot simply be self-sufficient when property taxes are due annually.
Within this system, every citizen must participate in some form of commerce to meet those obligations. Neither goats nor gold can satisfy this bill; hard currency is required.
This construct does not benefit the majority, only those who hold power and seek to keep it. Neither currency nor commerce represent the underlying problem; they are merely instruments designed to thieve power from man.
How else does one explain the concentration of wealth over time? Progressive income tax is needed to stabilize wealth from collapsing in on itself.
In Order for our societies to work in practice, taxes are needed. What to tax and by how much is up to political debate…
But there is evidence that high taxes combined with a great welfare state and some redistribution allows even capitalist societies to thrive. It even gets better when you specifically use taxes to reduce the difference between rich and poor.
There might be less billionaires in such situations, but everyone else is MUCH happier and well off.
So, from a consequentialist standpoint, more taxes, especially if progressive and hard enforced, are better.
Every counter argument to that seems to construct some reasoning from pure egoism and assuming someone is not a product of his environment - and ignoring the very first thing I said - taxes don’t have to be fair or just
Nevertheless, income tax is still needed, too. Usually it is designed progressive so that the lower income spectrum barely pays anything and it can go really high for obscene salaries