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Comment by mtlynch | Hacker News Reader

I'd love to work with US vendors because that would solve a lot of problems, but I tried twice in 2022, and it went disastrously both times.

I tried working with a US vendor on assembling PCBs, and the soldering was incredibly sloppy. They repaired it for free, but it was a month delay when we didn't have a lot of time to spare. I gave them another chance and the next batch they did had a defect rate of 30% whereas our Chinese vendor's rate is <1%, so I bailed on them at that point.

I also tried working with US-based sheet metal vendors on making enclosures for my product, and it cost 6x as much as the Chinese competitors for drastically poorer quality.[0]

[0] https://mtlynch.io/retrospectives/2022/11/#with-metal-cases-...

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I hear a lot of stories like this and I boggle. Back in the 1970s, American car makers took it on the chin because their quality was so much lower than Japanese imports. And it's not like the Japanese approach was a secret; Toyota has been positively evangelical about the Lean model.

I get that it's hard to compete on price with overseas labor. But in theory, our more-educated workforce should let us find non-price advantages, like quality and service. I have theories as to where the problems lie, but it seems so wild to me that this 50-year-old problem hasn't been licked.

Vertically-integrated success stories like Tesla can't be that shoddy in quality, when compared to the horror stories here.

Maybe the truth somehow lies more along the path of antiquated ecosystems leading to too-lenient customers, the way the space launch industry could allow itself to be incredibly wasteful until SpaceX came along.

An odd example, given that Tesla is known for mediocre quality. But yes, success stories are definitionally better than the usual; there are definitely places that don't fit the stereotype. E.g., Wahl clippers, or some of the companies in the Lean orbit, like the ones Kevin Meyer [1] has been involved in. But still, it sounds like the average level of quality is way lower, and I don't think that's just due to the customers.

[1] https://kevinmeyer.com/bio

Thanks for your post and sharing your progress. I look forward to the next one.

As a little bootstrapped startup, I can relate. I've also had on-shore production and sourcing issues that couldn't be resolved without unexpected costs/delays. And, culturally, Chinese vendors seem more straightforward or at least aligned with small makers. Their starting point is what they can offer rather than qualifying you as a customer.

I ran my startup 7 years in China doing pcba, injection molding etc. The speed is really amazing. Now trying a more hybrid model though.. Contact me if you need tips!

Oh, I'd love that! I'll reach out.

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