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Most people are happy with it even though it's overpriced. Suggesting it's a scam insults peoples' intelligence.

The same applies to the Star Wars hotel. It's not for you, nobody is holding a gun to your head making you stay there. For the people paying, it's worth it to them.

What you call fleecing the customer, I call charging the market rate.

If your employer offered you a raise, would you turn it down because you don't want to fleece the customer?

A nice guitar costs just as much, despite being functionally equivalent to one 1/3 its price.

There’s not a ton of rationality in music gear, people like what they like.

Why you are comparing guitar to a synth ?

Nice guitar (aside brand tax) has actual cost to make it, plastic toy like OP-1 is very cheap in comparison.

Hell, it's probably cheaper to make than random ass $500 behringer synth, even at unit count

With respect, that comparison fails, because a $1,500 guitar will be noticeably more playable and have a substantially better sound than a $500 guitar. (Source: have played guitar for 35 years.)

The point people are making here is that everything the OP-1 does can be achieved or surpassed with a couple of $10 apps and a low-end general purpose computing device.

> But, people pay for it. They want the whittled down, inspiring experience without any of the effort or trouble.

I don't know if this is the right analogy. Some people want to pay for features _not_ to be included in stuff because they enjoy the simplicity.

There are phones that don't have a browser or let you download apps, for example. That's not a "scam", that's just marketing to people who want simplicity.

Leica charges hundreds more for monochrome-only and screenless models of their cameras. The fact that there have been several generations of their suggests it's working and helps keep them afloat.

shouldn't there be a normally priced equivalent product on the market? it's not like we're talking about cutting edge silicon here

There are. Much like the Disney analogy, there are other cheaper theme parks on the market. The OP-1 is "unique" though, in the sense that (thankfully) nobody else is making a 4-track digital tape recorder anymore. There are hundreds of products like it, but much like the Star Wars hotel, nobody is dumb/rich enough to build a replica of Disney's attraction.

I could name a dozen grooveboxes that can be had for under $300 today, but it's all sorta besides the point. People want the OP-1 because it's what they see on YouTube, not because it makes music. Considering how long the product has stagnated, I see no reason that it should cost as much as it does today.

What are the options with similar portability, sampling, synthesis, fx, and multitrack recording, that you can buy new, and is not just an ipad or something, for under 300 dollars?

You've sorta missed my analogy. You can get a Novation Circuit, Electribe or even a brand-new Model: Samples for less than $300, but none of them are the "Star Wars Hotel" that the OP-1 is. I could show you a product that is exactly the same and cost's half as much, but people will balk at it complaining that it doesn't have a cow animation like the OP-1 does.

They've "productized" an instrument that shouldn't cost more than $200 to manufacture at their scale. I'm mostly mad at how consistently stupid their target audience is, not the fact that they exist.

>I could show you a product that is exactly the same and cost's half as much

Show it, then. (and btw "half as much" is significantly more than "under 300 dollars")

>but people will balk at it complaining that it doesn't have a cow animation like the OP-1 does.

Probably I will complain that it lacks synthesis, a multitrack recorder capable of making long tracks, an input for sampling, or something. (I agree the animations in TE stuff are silly though).

The OP-1's synthesis engine is so stiff that I'd argue it doesn't have one either. It's subtractive synth may as well be sample-based, the FM model is fine but incredibly simple, the Karpluss-Strong engine is fun but one-note and the sampler doesn't really fill in the rest of the cracks. It's a fine machine, but arguing that it's both a synth and a multitrack recorder ignores the fact that both of those features are pretty compromised.

I posted some examples of cheap, shitty grooveboxes I would prefer to the OP-1 in another comment below. Understandably not all of them will be to everyone's liking, but all of them are cheaper than the OP-1 and easier for me to recommend to learning musicians.

I am also interested in the $300-500 all-in-one groovebox rivaling the OP-1 (without cow animation)

Same, show me what’s out there.

- Elektron Model: Samples

- Novation Circuit

- Roland MC-101

- Korg Electribe

- Used Digitakt

- (God forbid) Teenage Engineering OP-Z

The list goes on but those are the big names. Again, I'm mostly fascinated that such a nothingburger company like TE can capture the hearts of rich people everywhere. Maybe it just goes to show that the most successful businesses aren't the ones with the best products, but with the most effective marketing and highest sex appeal.

>the most successful businesses aren't the ones with the best products, but with the most effective marketing and highest sex appeal.

This goes without saying.

Also, having owned/used over half of those on the list, none of them emulate the tape functionality, which is arguably the OP-1's killer feature in the same way that the sequencer is the OP-Z's.

I am not an OP-1 user nor am I a TE fanboy but I owned a Model:Samples and the simple fact that you cannot even sample on it and it doesn't have any synth capabilities cannot make it a candidate. The digitakt is not a synth either. Same with original Novation circuit and with Novation you'd have to buy both the circuit track and the circuit rhythm if my memory is correct to be able to both record/sample and use a synth. MC-101 seems completely different in term of ergonomics.

I wouldn't say any of them would be an alternative.

I think OP-1 is overpriced because there is nothing like it. I mean a secondhand laptop with a 69$ daw such as Reaper can do more, an MPC is more complete. But people who see the appeal of the OP-1 probably already have a computer and a DAW so this is not what they are looking for. They want a toy to make music.

I am not in the market for such a thing but I guess it is not that overpriced if some people are willing to buy it at this price.

https://dirtywave.com/

Close enough.

That's a $600 product. Perhaps less expensive but not not-expensive. And it lacks knobs and piano keys.

No cow animation, either... completely unusable.

I'm speaking from a place of ignorance. If the objects are so alike, care explaining how? To an outsider like me they look 100% different.

The new OP-1 is 2000 euro. So $600 is less than half

> And it lacks knobs and piano keys

Well you can get like a dozen of various sized synths for that price but you'd then complain it has too many knobs and keys

But it is successful because it is totally not an OP-1.

It's not $300, but the SP404 MK2 is sweet

Agreed, and the MPC One is an amazing value for all it can do.

I really want a Pioneer Toraiz SP-16 but can't justify it to myself because I really don't need it

> and is not just an ipad or something

That's the rub. I have no interest in the TE stuff (or, for that matter, most other manufacturer's stuff), but what we can do on our hosts, these days, is amazing.

I remember using a Tascam recorder for our sessions, where you keep remixing tracks, until the hiss becomes your "signature sound."

Nowadays, you can have a 24-track, digital system on your handheld, for peanuts.

Right, these products don’t work for me because their interfaces reproduce what was bad about 1980ies technology: small screens, shift buttons to enable multiple functions, lots of conventions you have to learn by heart. DAW’s are so much easier to use! That’s not to say I don’t like physical hardware—it makes so much sense for analog synths, mixing desks, guitar pedals etc. or whatever instrument where you have a nice chunky button for each function.

It's not normally called "scam" when you just take a simple product, wrap it with lots of marketing and branding, and overprice it.

Or maybe it is, in which case the entire modern economy is a scam. Ok I see where this thread is going from here.