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Comment by moonchrome | Hacker News Reader

That attitude is so delusional it's hilarious.

Sorry but your ancestors were regularly getting eaten alive by wild animals a few generations back (heck it's still an existential threat to some people). People had to resort to canibalism to survive famines. Plague, TB, polio. Just a hundred years ago there was ~1 in 100 chance a woman would die during childbirth. >40% of kids would not live to age of 5 in 1800s

The only reason you were brought into this world is because your ancestors went through shit you can't even imagine, had children, some of which survived to eventually have you.

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As you go back through the ages life gets worse. The implication is that life in the present is supposed to be the best possible life. Consequently there is nothing wrong with trying to optimize it to be even better that it is right now. That's literally the purpose of being here, especially if you have children.

Stating that life should be hard now because your ancestors had it worse is completely missing the point. They all strived to make life better for their progeny. We need to be doing the same. That means refusing to accept things being worse than necessary.

Phrasing it as "I was not brought into this world for" - is entitlement by birth which I find ridiculous.

I have nothing against wanting to improve your condition or striving for better - but expecting something just because you were born or a human - really needs some reality checking.

Also your notion that human condition constantly improves through history is not a given - things can very much regress and humanity can disappear.

It's very probable that your highest contribution to society is 9-5 and supporting >2 kids - but it's not very popular to say that I guess.

>entitlement

Everyone is entitled to fight for better conditions

>things can very much regress

That was gp's point

>As you go back through the ages life gets worse.

Which life is better on the whole? That of an apex predator in its natural environment or that of livestock?

There is a case to be made that modern humans have been progressively turned into domesticated livestock, abstracted from their ancestral, natural habitat since the neolithic revolution.

It is unclear that cell phones and modern medicine increase net happiness when many work soul sucking, unhealthy sedentary jobs and suffer a long gray existence in nursing homes and hospitals.

> Sorry but your ancestors were regularly getting eaten alive by wild animals a few generations back (heck it's still an existential threat to some people). People had to resort to canibalism to survive famines. Plague, TB, polio. Just a hundred years ago there was ~1 in 100 chance a woman would die during childbirth. >40% of kids would not live to age of 5 in 1800s

I'm not sure how this counters the idea that we should not dedicate our lives to menial jobs. It seems kind of unrelated.

> That attitude is so delusional it's hilarious.

I wish we turned down the snark a little bit at HN.

You see your sacrifice, you uber drivers, warehouse pickers, even coders, affords the few who control capital by force of law a blissful existence.

The existential angst you feel is the price society pays so a few can reap clear benefits while many keep pace with the hedonic hampster wheel.

I mean clearly it is a price worth paying so we can watch people do silly dances on tiktok or summon an uber at 2 am to take us home from the bar.

So what? My ancestors survived that means I should be happy spending half my waking life doing meaningless labor for a faceless corporation to feed and shelter myself.

Justify wasting your life however you want but calling those who don't agree with your cope "delusional" is rich.

I think a lot of us would agree we’d get more fulfillment with fighting off those wild animals and going through through that shit than cranking out Jira tickets and moving them between columns.

If this is true then living through hardship is still possible. There are places in the world with very low living standards and it's possible to move and live there. The military still exists. Working long shifts and living in man camps at the fringes of the developed world still exists.

I've done this thought exercise many times, traveled extensively, and continue trying different types of work. The truth is that most of us (HN users) have pretty comfortable lives and would be making huge quality of life sacrifices to live the dream of the romanticized past.

There is definitely something to sort out around "what does the high paid knowledge worker do when they no longer have hardship defining their life for them" but I don't know if artificially handicapping yourself and LARPing struggle is the answer.

If you do find the answer then please let me know.

I think the biggest error is mistaking comfort for happiness.

If you aren't happy in your current position you have two choices. You either choose to solve the problem and start taking steps, or you choose to be distracted from the problem.

I know the best times of my life is when I got outside of my comfort zone.

Fear is a cage. The only way out, is through.

> That attitude is so delusional it's hilarious

Can you articulate the attitude you're reacting against? Because you don't appear to be addressing the OP, who never made a claim about their ancestors having a tough go of it.

Some things are relative.

> I was not brought into this world to work for 60 years in a job [...] It’s a shame so much of us are forced to spend the best parts of our lives chained to a desk.

Our ancestors would kill for the ability to replace their existence by a desk job.

> Our ancestors would kill for the ability to replace their existence by a desk job

Likely many of them did kill for the ability to make sure their children had a better life than they did.

But also, why would we need to be sensitive of their feelings?

Many of our ancestors killed other ancestors because there wasn't enough resources | food | land | conquest

Man of our ancestors didn't survive the winter, or the plague, or slavery...that doesn't mean I want or necessarily need to wear my self out for someone else's portfolio.

I've had years where I was only present the last 5 minutes before passing out each night. the other 23:55 of the day spent in a mad rush, eat/sleep/work/repeat.

That's nothing to be proud of, especially if you don't have to.

People should suffer at work even if they find a way avoid or reduce the suffering?

What's the connection between our ancestors' collective success and advancement, and our present-day, individual suffering?

We are here because the human race improved itself, its conditions, to lessen and adapt to environmental limitations and even our own political issues. Not because we worked 50 hour weeks in dead end jobs.

Are you saying the only two conceivable states for humanity to be in is 1. to be chased by sabre tooth tigers and dying of polio or 2. slaving away in an Amazon warehouse, the only imaginable sanctuary from wild beasts?

I have to admit that's a new one when it comes to defending the status quo of our work culture

People in the past also had a fun and also seeked meaning. They were also seeking relationships and socialization. Some were rich and led iddle lifestyle and yes some were slaves.

However, the basic human "I don't want more then this" was present in all of them.

It is nit like everyone in history was simultaneously subject of famine, tuberculosis and then died in childbirth.

Thank you for this.

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