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Comment by londons_explore | Hacker News Reader

The thing is... If they offered a full refund of the FSD money to any owner today, I'd take a bet that most owners wouldn't take the offer.

Thats because FSD now costs more to buy, so these people still think they've got a good deal. It still adds more value to their car 2nd hand than they paid for it.

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Wait, isn't FSD non-transferrable?

It’s non-transferable in the sense that it stays with the car, not the owner. If the owner buys a new car they have to buy the FSD package again. But the car they sell on the second hand market will keep the FSD package, unless they sell it back to Tesla. In that case Tesla usually disables it before putting it back on the market.

> In that case Tesla usually disables it before putting it back on the market.

To do this is a really interesting business move. At first glance, they are throwing away revenue (because a 2nd hand car with FSD presumably sells for more than one without). But they might be able to sell it as an addon or a subscription to the new owner... But the chances of that are probably low to those buying 2nd hand cars.... But also by artificially restricting the numbers of cars available on the market with FSD enabled, those which do have FSD enabled will keep their value better... Which may in turn help with sales of the feature with brand new cars...

I bet there is a really big spreadsheet written by an MBA to make this decision...

They aren't throwing away any revenue. If they sold it as part of the car it would either be discounted roughly like the used vs new value of the car or would make the car look expensive if at full price. Instead people who want FSD can get the car for "cheap" and then pay then pay full price for FSD.

FSD can already handle most drives really well, and has progressed further than any competitor (by a wide margin). I'd expect ~20-30% would take the refund.

It can. But the drives it can't drive well can be catastrophic. There are countless videos and reports of FSD doing the exact wrong thing at the worst possible time, and immediate driver intervention was require to avoid catastrophe. Mind boggling things like swerving on oncoming traffic.

I wouldn't take the offer. I only paid $5k for it and I've already used it enough to be satisfied. I never expected whatever level of automation all the detractors are always going on about. Can't say that other "scams" have been so useful in real world use cases. I don't think I'd pay $10k or more for it at this state though, but that should be up to the consumer in my opinion.

Frankly it's far less of a scam than 80% of the crap that gets posted here on HN.

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