Ask HN: Is the Party Over? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: Is the Party Over?

26 pointswhatifitisnt21 comments

Since 8/Dec I've had 2 offers rescinded, and one one final interview pushed out a month, then canceled 30 minutes before the meeting. All 3 of them YC companies.

How do people over the age of 35 maintain optimism in what is clearly 2001 all over again.

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Because it's not 2001 all over again. YC companies and other startups are feeling the crunch, but plenty of other places are still hiring. Check out your local govt - chances are they're hiring. It's not sexy, but there's still plenty of work to be found.

Actually, I'm not over 35 so I guess my opinion doesn't count here

> Is the Party Over?

For now.

> How do people over the age of 35 maintain optimism in what is clearly 2001 all over again.

People over 35 have seen bear markets before 1980-1982, 1987, 2000-2002, and 2007-2009. Quantitative easing had flattened out typical market cycles for years leaving people unprepared for market contractions. Now post-COVID we are getting our first bear market in over 15 years and the Fed can’t save us because more inflation would inflationary spiral. The market will change in the future and companies will start hiring again, but in the meantime you might have to take a job you don’t want in an industry you did not see yourself in.

> People over 35 have seen bear markets before 1980-1982, 1987, 2000-2002...

Yes, how could a 35-year-old forget those bear markets that happened when they were 13, 0 and -5 years old...

Fair enough! I do have coworkers nearing retirement that would have seen all of the above bear markets. If you were around for at least the 2001 (dot com bust) and the 2008 (financial crisis) you should know better than to think this is the end of tech. Best to steel up.

Don’t get it. YC companies are like, what, 0.001% of the total number of tech companies out there. Try with the other 99.999%

Have you tried applying at profitable companies that don’t depend on VC funding or larger, established enterprises?

> How do people over the age of 35 maintain optimism in what is clearly 2001 all over again.

Consider boring, stable companies for this macroeconomic chapter.

I don't know about OP, but personally, I sold my house, moved to the third world, and retired in my mid '40s last year when it became clear I would never again a job making as much as I did in 2019. 2019: 325k. 2020: Laid off the day the Covid layoffs began. 2022: All salary ranges were below $150k.

I used to live this industry, but not enough to take a 55% pay cut and keep working 50-60 hour weeks. Fuck it.

The companies who have called me in the last 3 years have all been shitty crypto companies, half of which now bankrupt, so I decided 45 was a good day to buy a 16-unit apartment building in the Balkans become a rent seeking landlord.

> I used to live this industry, but not enough to take a 55% pay cut and keep working 50-60 hour weeks. Fuck it.

But there are companies out there that do not force you to work 50-60 hours/week. I'm not sure about your particular situation, but in general as I get more experienced, I tend to work less. For instance: I work as a regular employee, 40h/week (8h/day), but I put around 3h/day max. everyday. 3h/day of focused work is enough to get things done and say something in the daily standup of the following day. But yeah, pay cuts suck.

I think it's a lottery. You can be lucky and find good companies, or you can be unlucky and end up in toxic environments. Personally I was too trusting of teams who put their best foot forward in the interviews and are at best, misleading of the actual culture. It's a very abusive industry, especially working for start-ups.

I’d be interested to hear about your Balkans real estate investing if you’re up for a convo.

The economy is cyclical. If you feel like it’s 2001 now, 2003 is only two years away.

I'm in my thirties. Got ghosted, interview-cancelled and offer-cancelled the last 3 months. But I also got 2 offers for software engineer positions in early December 2022, both B2B and regular employments, and just started working fulltime on one of those.

I'd say keep looking and keep increasing your interview skills.

This isn't really 2001 all over again except for crypto companies that want to centralize money on a decentralized platform and then commit fraud. Or the companies that trusted those "trust me, I'll hold the wallet" companies. Startups see the effects of the economy first because the typical path is to raise seed rounds until you are profitable. Sometimes profitable never happens or the ramp is too long and in a recession the funding may not be there for the next seed round which means they can't expand and maybe they can't make payroll.

If you look outside the world of startups there are tons of employers that need software people. You aren't going to see crazy comp or equity but you can make a career out of stable job, stable high pay (when compared to the rest of humans on the planet) and not being worked to burnout.

Don't worry about startups for a while? Or look into military contractors instead of the consumer market. My mom's company got off the ground in 01 because of big contractors contracting out to smaller companies. (Unless Raytheon makes your optimism decline even more idk)

I would imagine by knowing the world didn't end in 2001. Things got worse for a while, but then for better again.

well it’s easier to face when you are financially independent

we did have a 12 year bull run after all

We don't.

I truly believe most software development careers die at 35 or 40 years old max. Currently looking to jump to something else because this field does not like experience. People say they want experienced people, but they don't hire them and still go with the 1-10 years interval.

Yeah I think this is kinda true.

My argument would be that "kinda". is nuanced. ;) Its true only if one doesn't take action to mitigate it. (IMHO, of course, but as someone over 40 )

Don't jump! ;). Perhaps look at more sensible/ laid back places in public sector? e:g gov't, academia, they value experience. There's plenty of threads on HN about ageism and how to cope in the tech industry as you get older, plenty of comments from really old programmers. Its totally do-able. I think the reason you see some people's careers "die" is - they lost their technical edge due to things like (1) doing too much management and not enough coding at work (2) trying to chase too much rapidly changing tech (3) simply burning out from overwork and not enough holidays (4) picking the wrong tech to invest in e:g something with vendor lock-in. Open source projects are a better investment. Certain skills gonna be here for ever, others not. Its a meta-skill to know how to "back the right horse".

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