Comment by kfsnd | Hacker News Reader

Comment by kfsnd | Hacker News Reader

> I’m a bit puzzled by that “But people are already doing it” argument. Yes, Mastodon traffic either is already or soon will be captured and filed permanently as in forever

Correct. This is something I and several others have been doing for some time now. We have a private search engine that covers most of the Mastodon fediverse (including widely defederated instances), and there's nothing anyone can do about it.

Eventually, we'll give this data to the Internet Archive or put it in a torrent or something. It includes a decent amount of now-deleted content too.

Really, it's no different to what others, e.g. Pushshift, are doing with other sites. Except there's no opt-out. Anything you've already said is almost certainly in our data set, and it's there permanently.

> That’s extremely hard to prevent but isn’t really the problem: The problem would be a public search engine that Gamergaters and Kiwifarmers use to hunt down vulnerable targets.

Also correct. A couple of KFers we know already have access to search the data we've collected. It points them towards interesting posts or accounts to archive. People say some pretty wild things when they think they're not being recorded for posterity!

I'm amazed sometimes at the datasets KFers uses for doxxing. If you care enough, you just need to pay attention to leaks and store them all and you can make a mini NSA X-Keyscore.

During the whole Cloudflare banning thing I remember coming across a dox that deanonymized someone via the Patreon hack dump [1], where a simple Twitter username match turned into a name + address (via credit card details stored by Patreon).

Anonymity and OPSEC requires some serious effort and knowledge.

[1] https://www.christianpost.com/news/patreon-hack-almost-14-gb...

Serious effort - as in - not reusing usernames and not posting embarassing stuff using your real name?

Yes, telling people to not reuse passwords is enough of an ask.

So, among the first people you give access to the search are some known harassers? Sharp thinking, there.

I mean, look at the facts:

- permanently archiving posts they know people don’t want them to

- gave early access to known trolls

- is now publicly crowing about how there’s nothing you can do about it

- on a throwaway, because like most bullies they’re cowards

Personally, I’m left wondering if there needs to be an organized crime investigation into KF, for organized harassment campaigns which violate local stalking or other laws, and the role people like this account play in orchestrating it.

I think there’s be a certain irony to HN’s record of this comment being used to prosecute an accomplice in organized crime.

I mean, "kfsnd." KF. They're not exactly hiding who they are.

Shrug.

They’re on a throwaway because they’re too cowardly to admit who they are and face people like myself who want to hold them accountable for their bullying.

I think they’re exactly hiding who they are.

Seems prudent when you have people calling for you to be prosecuted as a criminal accomplice. ;)

Now now. Be fair. Some of us would be quite content with your ongoing persecution.

Of course — that’s the difference between us:

I act in a way I can publicly own.

You act in a way you know that you have to hide — because you’re aware that’s it’s anti-social.

I have no dog in this fight (probably will never use mastodon or this search engine) but I do find it ironic that this guy is being insulted for using a throwaway by people advocating for privacy on mastodon.

If you don't want your stuff permanently archived then don't post it on public websites. It's sad that people don't give a shit about their privacy and overshare everything these days.

No — I’m tired of saying all of society needs to walk on eggshells due to anti-social people like OP.

If you go around a bar with a tape recorder and directional microphone capturing conversations from unsuspecting people and then use those private moments to launch protracted harassment campaigns, you’re an asshole.

No matter how much you say “they didn’t have an expectation of privacy!”

That's not comparable to posting messages on public websites that can be read by anyone without an account. You don't know who will read them.

If you want to talk privately - talk to people that you trust and use apps like Signal that delete messages after some time.

When you speak in public, anyone can hear you.

What specifically do you feel is different?

If you say embarassing shit or shout obscenities in public then don't be surprised if someone pulls out their phone and starts recording it.

It's completely different if someone sneaks into your home and leaves microphones there.

Yes — and we’re asking about the case of a quiet conversation in a bar, where someone surreptitiously records using specialize equipment.

I think it’s very telling you made a strawman rather than respond to that point.

I think both of you are visualising "posting on the Fediverse" differently. One visualises it as a conversation between two people that may be overheard, while the other visualises it as broadcasting.

When you say things on the internet, you say them publicly, and people are allowed to remember your words.

It the same as dropping wireless mics and facial recognition tech on public sidewalks. It might be legal but social norms make it weird. The people that do it will find out their lives get quite a bit harder when they're found out.

Lots of security cameras record what's happening on public sidewalks. Lots of cars have dashcams in them.

Thanks, but that's not really relevant.

Posting on Twitter or Mastodon is the equivalent of shouting on a public street. If you don't want to face the consequences of what you say, don't say it publicly (or at least don't do it with your real name).

No — the expectation was never that people would creepily record every corner of the public sphere.

That’s anti-social behavior and it’s okay to call it such.

If it wasn't an expectation, then it SHOULD have been. People are allowed to remember and record what you yell on the street, just like they are allowed to remember and record what you post on a public platform for anyone to see.

Genuinely, thank you for your service. A real archive doesn't delete a collection because of public pressure like "The Internet Archive" does.

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