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Comment by SoftTalker | Hacker News Reader

It's already illegal to hire illegal aliens. Why will REAL ID change anything in that regard?

Employers who disregard the law now will continue to disregard the law.

It depends on state to state. In California, you can get non-REAL ID if you have at least one form of ID (i.e. passport from another country). Doesn't matter whether you're documented or not.

REAL ID looks different and essentially proves that you are not undocumented.

Visually, there used to be no difference between ID for undocumented and documented, so you can travel freely. My immigration lawyer recommended against traveling to AZ with that ID.

Not sure what it changes in terms of hiring. Even with REAL ID after background check, I had to submit proof that I'm allowed to work in this country.

> It's already illegal to hire illegal aliens. Why will REAL ID change anything in that regard?

It's hard to enforce that when there's no easy way to prove someone isn't in the country legally.

How does Real ID help prove that someone who doesn’t have one isn’t here legally?

I am here legally and renewed my license since my state offered Real ID. I still got the old “Not for Federal ID” license. If I show that to someone, does that somehow prove I’m not here legally?

If you represent an expired or otherwise invalidated license as legitimate proof of ID then that's fraud. I'm sure a sufficiently dedicated citizen can find a way to pretend to be here illegally, but as long as you're not going to mix up a reasonable law-abiding citizen with an illegal immigrant you can arrest them and sort it out afterwards.

I have literally no idea what you’re talking about.

My state offers RealID now. When I renewed last year, I received a valid, current, expires in 2026, drivers license that is not a Real ID/is Not for Federal ID. (I’m a citizen.)

Are you trying to say that Real ID makes it easier to prove someone is here legally? I agree with that.

P => Q does not mean that (not P) => (not Q) ∴ RealID doesn’t help prove someone is not here legally.

It won’t stop cash transactions, but it will hinder inter-state movement as generally give police an extra reason to detain somebody.

Businesses just ask for a social security number, and a random one is provided.

So they can plead ignorance.

No, they are supposed to ask for documentation, not just a number.

https://www.uscis.gov/i-9-central/form-i-9-acceptable-docume...

That's if you're hiring an immigrant as an immigrant, not as something who pretends to be a citizen.

No; the I-9 process is for everyone.

No that's incorrect. I-9 verification is for everyone including citizens. Basically you need to show proof that you are legally allowed to work in the US which also applies to citizens. Source: I am an employer.

My bad. I wish I could delete my comment now :(

I think I saw it's USCIS form and jumped to conclusion...

Enforcement is weak, and there's strong political pressure to keep it weak.

"You may NOT require your employees or potential employees to use Self Check or myE-Verify under any circumstances. Requiring applicants to provide proof of their employment authorization before they accept an offer of employment is known as “pre-screening” and it may constitute a violation of the anti-discrimination provision of the Immigration and Nationality Act. You may not require an employee, once hired, to use Self Check or myE-Verify. Use E-Verify to confirm a new employee’s work authorization."

[1] https://www.e-verify.gov/mye-verify/self-check/employers

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