Ask HN: How do you fall asleep? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: How do you fall asleep?

I've been trying to not use my phone while falling asleep but found it more challenging than I would have thought. What do you do when you are falling asleep?

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An old mentor gave me advice that I think has done me very well: only use your bed for sleep and sex.

Don't read in bed. Don't listen to anything that requires brainpower (spoken word, for instance). Turn off the light and go to sleep. If you're not really ready to sleep, and feel the need to do a little reading, surfing, whatever, get out of bed and do it elsewhere. So I don't even bring my phone/tablet/whatever into the bedroom at all.

The idea is to program your brain to associate bed with sleep, so going to bed is a stronger cue that it's sleepytime.

Sounds good. Except that if I can't watch something or at least listen to something in bed. I will delay bedtime as long as possible. But if I can watch some tv series or something I usually fall asleep in 5-10min.

I follow the bed only for sleep and sex rule but my motivations are different. I generally don’t like the idea of being supine at any point in the day. It helps keep me active and productive, even on a lazy weekend.

I set the alarm on my phone, lay it next to wherever I am laying my head (a pillow, rock, chair, floor, - doesn't matter wherever I lay my head for longer than 10 minutes with my eyes closed I fall asleep), close my eyes and fall asleep.

In the morning I hit snooze 2,000 times and then get out of bed semi-rested and start the day.

EDIT: typo

That's me. I try to decide how much longer I can sleep before the first meeting.

You could try sophrology. I always struggled to fall asleep, I even went to a doctor specialist in sleep disorder without success: I did a polysomnography which revealed nothing bad physiologically, no medicines or tips helped me. My sleep was really an issue in my day-to-day life for at least 15 years.

By despair last year I did six one-to-one lessons with a specialist in sophrology. I now regularly quickly fall asleep even if I do not do the exercises as often as I should.

I consider myself cured, and I still do not understand why I am now.

What's sophrology? I know I can Google it but would you mind sharing your own explanation of what it is and how it helped?

My explanation may not be accurate but this is how I see sophrology and what I remember from my lessons. Note that what I explain is not necessarily my opinion or belief. I am not someone who is into spiritual or "new age" stuff.

Sophrology is a relaxation method. When you do a session, you focus on a particular issue to remove or lower it. This is a goal-centered method. I will explain a bit how you do a session.

The first thing to do when you start sophrology is to learn how to breathe "correctly". Most adults seem to breathe "from the torso". This is not good because it constraints your breath, and you do not feel relaxed. On the other hand, babies breath using "the belly". You can see their bellies inflate and deflate while they breathe. Using this technique, you have plenty of space to breathe correctly, and you feel relaxed.

Sophrology divides the body in five zones: the head, the neck, the torso (with the arms and hands), the upper part of your belly, the lower part of your body down to the feet. Then the belly button represents the whole body. During the session you will have to focus on each of these six zones one at a time.

In each session, you have multiple exercises to do. You stand when you do an exercise; then you sit in a relaxed position for a while so your body and your mind absorb what you learned from the exercise.

1. You "clean" yourself by doing dynamic stretching. Slowly you start to close your eyes for the whole session and you focus on breathing correctly.

2. You take consciousness on your body, by focusing on each zone at a time.

3. You relax yourself, each zone at a time.

4. You do the exercise corresponding to what you want to achieve with this session (getting sleep, make your anger disappear, lowering a physical pain...);

5. At last you reactivate yourself physically, and finally you open your eyes.

The main point of the session is to go into a state that is close to slumber before you reactivate your body. You should feel yourself very relaxed and not wanting to do anything in this state. Also during the whole session you use positive reinforcement. You must talk to yourself in a positive manner.

I suppose it helped me because this is a mix of relaxation exercises, auto-hypnosis and positive psychology. It is not coated into spiritual and religious stuff: I am not trying to ascend into a new layer of existence. It is not focusing on negative things as it does in stoicism.

To be honest, it was difficult at first for me to do ridiculous exercises and paying for that! :)

But it worked for me and I feel way better now that I am not anxious anymore at the idea of going into bed. As I wrote, I do not understand why it was so effective so quickly after I struggled for years and years with sleep issues. And I do not understand why it is still that effective now that I do not do the exercises very often.

Beautiful. Thanks for taking the time to explain in detail.

I suffer from severe Thanatophobia, so quiet times with few distractions put me at risk of a panic attack.

I'm a side-sleeper and I prefer to go to sleep with the TV on, but my wife requires complete darkness for sleep, so I listen to boring/news podcasts with these: https://www.cozyphones.com

Edit: I have an older bluetooth model they seem to not sell anymore. Weird.

I have random YouTube video essays or podcasts on. Sometimes with rain sound or fake a/c sounds playing too. In the past it was shows like The Office. I keep the screen off. I fall asleep with one or two headphones in. My advice is pick something you're familiar with or, if you want something new, pick something you don't care to rewind for.

If I am really struggling, I play chess puzzles or 3+2 time control on Lichess. I haven't learned any meaningful opening theory and I don't care to right now, tactics or the Chess960 format with a computer is nice for that.

Awhile ago I read a tip that relaxing your face muscles, especially forehead can help you fall asleep faster. Occasionally I still use this technique and it works for me.

This is a good one! Progressive muscle relaxation I think it's called. You can start in your toes for example and progress all the way up your body through to your face.

Even before having a smart phone, I always powered off my phone at least an hour before I plan to sleep. I also avoid watching any videos or news that is anxiety inducing.

Diet wise, I avoid sugar like the plague. About an hour before going to bed I take L-Theanine, B1 benfotiamine, D3, K2, chelated magnesium taurate and "Sleep Better" capsules which are just Organic Ashwagandha root (Withania somnifera), Organic Skullcap tops (Scutellaria lateriflora), Organic Valerian root (Valeriana officinalis), Organic Passionflower tops (Passiflora incarnata), Organic Hops strobiles (Humulus lupulus), pullulan. These are "adaptogens".

I keep my room dark and cool which is easy this time of year. I have a HEPA filter that adds a constant but quiet noise to reduce the chances of coyotes or deer waking me up.

For a while, I would do a crossword puzzle before bed. Specifically - tough ones that make you do letter permutations to get solutions (ax,ay,az,ba,bb,bc).

Also, make sure you get cold before you get in bed. Chill is actually a strong sleep signal. If I am laying in bed before sleeping, I make sure I am on top of the covers until I sleep.

Lately though, I have been using my phone much more before bed time. Solitaire games, engineering videos on Youtube, or Wikipedia articles. Blue light filter or no - so long as I stay away from news and opinion, I actually haven't really had a problem. (It's probably still not for the best that I am training my brain that technical content = sleep)

I like reading but if it's a book I'm interested in I tend to read the whole thing and then it's 4am and I haven't slept much at all. Another problem is that I'm reading on my phone and the temptation of YouTube is just a few swipes away. The technical stuff I like to watch often wakes me up since it is quite interesting.

The only times I struggle to fall asleep are when I've consumed any amount of caffeine (or other stimulant) within ~8hrs of attempting to sleep.

Doing a couple sets of pushups every morning and evening makes eyes closed -> passed out happen more quickly, especially if I otherwise didn't do anything active throughout the day.

Sleep comes very quickly if the day was spent mountain biking, hiking, or digging with the pickaxe and shovel.

If you're caffeinated/energy drink fueled and sedentary at a desk all day, expect to stay up. Preventing that is a simple matter of cut down the stimulants and get a bit more physical activity.

I feel like this is stating the obvious though, YMMV

My rule that has significantly increased my quality of sleep is absolutely no phone in the bedroom. I leave it in another room - otherwise it's impossible not to be on the phone at night or in the morning. I use a $5 alarm clock from walmart that runs on a AA battery (I've replaced it once in the 7 or so years I've had it)

I do read in bed sometimes though (book / kindle)

I usually fall asleep within 5-10 mins of closing my eyes, if I bring my phone I always get less sleep since I spend way too much time on it

I do sometimes struggle to fall back asleep if I wake up in the middle of the night - have to do some breathing exercises to shut my brain off

I fall asleep a few minutes after I lay down on bed, does not matter if it's day or night. If I can't fall asleep at night and I know I have to be fresh next day, I focus on each muscle in my body and consciously relax it. I start from muscles above my eyes, my jaw, my neck, upper and lower arms (one after another), all fingers, then same with legs. Once I'm done with all parts of my body I start again. Sometimes I also imagine black velvet during this exercise. I usually fall asleep after second round of relaxing my muscles.

5mg melatonine, headphones with podcasts which I don't find irritating (curating such list is harder and harder) and a facemask. It works irrespectively of stress level on a given day.

Beyond typical sleep hygiene I can recommend one practice that I've found to be helpful: Reverse through your day in your head. Go backwards and imagine everything you did that day in as much detail as you care to. Don't linger on any one moment. Usually I will fall asleep before I get to the beginning of the day. An added benefit is that it will increase your awareness of how you show up and how you spend your time.

Recently I've been doing some deep, slow breathing before I go to sleep which has worked for me.

You can also try this relaxation technique that is meant to make you fall asleep: https://www.inc.com/melanie-curtin/want-to-fall-asleep-faste...

Very carefully. I was up until 4 am last night.

- A medication that induces sleep because it's technically a powerful antihistamine (Remeron)

- Dark room

- No TV or computer in room

- I've tried leaving a TV series iPad screen on low light and low volume to half watch like an "elderly person" falling asleep in front of the TV; I can't seem to get work notifications from not bugging me though.

Get yourself super tired. Exercise or kids will do that to you.

Also, chemistry matters. Be mindful of what you eat and when you wait it.

Some tips I have discovered:

1. Magnesium helps you relax.

2. Inhaling lavender is a great way to calm down the nervous system. This traditional remedy has some real science behind it: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=+lavender+sleep

I watch YouTube. Usually woodworking, metalworking, or weird cooking stuff.

Currently really into these Azerbaijani grandparents cooking outdoors https://youtube.com/@country_life_vlog

Yeah, I love the Pusik, that little dog!

Tizanidine.

Before I was prescribed that for unrelated reasons, quitting caffeine did a lot for my ability to sleep at night. I do want to try the whole 'use bed for only sleep' thing but my apartment is cold and I have a heated blanket on my bed which helps.

I pick a random episode of the In Our Time podcast and listen to it until I'm asleep.

When I can’t fall asleep I forcefully yawn for 5 to 10 minutes. Sleepiness soon follows.

1. I brush my teeth

2. Go to my bedroom

3. Put on my pajamas

4. Turn off the lights

5. Uncover the comforter

6. Lay on top of the fitted sheets

7. Cover back the comforter

8. Close my eyes

All kidding aside one thing that helps insomnia for me is doing long an complex math equations, functional programming problems, or reading heady philosophy. You could also try meditation.

Thinking about abstract problems leads to really weird conceptual dreams and worse sleep for me, so I'd try meditation first

What sort of functional programming problems?

Maybe try this simple counting technique inspired by mindfulness meditation: http://www.dirk-loss.de/calmyourmind/

I lie down and close my eyes.

I don't have my phone (or any other electronics in my bedroom). Sometimes I just get into bed and lie down and daydream a little until I fall asleep; sometimes I read a little until I feel sleepy.

I make sure to do 30-60 minutes exercise during the day.

And falling asleep is extremely easy.

When I don't exercise, I put on anything in the audio format- podcasts or audiobooks.

These method/s work every time.

If you don't fall asleep right away, get up and do something else and try again.

I believe this associates your bed with a time to sleep, rather than fitful struggles.

I like to listen to audiobooks -- old favorites where I already am familiar with the content. Set a 10 minute sleep timer and that's usually enough.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31849464

Usually, I put podcasts on a playlist. I drop off somewhere in that list.

When that doesn't work?

Benadryl. 10Mg and it's good night in roughly 40 minutes to an hour.

Diphenhydramine and other anti-histamines make me very groggy the next day, sometimes even for two days. On the plus side, I usually don't struggle to sleep. Most of the time...

Lucky for me I just don't have that response. And I am not a frequent user. Coupla times per month usually. And that's when my mind is just running...

Put my phone on airplane mode and fire up the brown noise. Tape my mouth shut. Fire up the ol CPAP. Knocks me out like a light.

Remove yourself from sources of radiofrequency radiation. Then you will begin producing melatonin again and sleep better.

Watching btc price stalled while hoping it'll do something useful.

I listen to Stephen Wolfram vlogs.

few seconds of deep breath and I'm gone

Listen to a podcast with the volume just above where I can begin to hear it. Helps me passively zone in on the narrative and this puts me to sleep within 15 minutes.

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