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Comment by ozim | Hacker News Reader

Participation trophies are not bullshit.

I think most damage to kids is done by people who claim participation trophies are bullshit.

These trophies are for encouraging people to try and do something and not thinking: "I am not going to win anyway so why bother trying at all".

Kids are smart and they also know that running that 5km run and finishing first is hard work. They might not be happy about participation trophy but still they should be praised for the effort of putting on shoes and trying.

There is a lot of psychology about effects of encouraging positive behaviors that is misunderstood. Even if you have employees it is much more effective to praise them on positive behaviors than scolding them for mistakes. Because scolding for mistakes will push them into direction "I am not going to do this task at all because if I make mistake I will get scolded, so why bother doing this task at all".

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Actually the research suggests that participation trophies are counter-productive, because it teaches kids that they don’t need to try, they are simply entitled to rewards: https://lancasteronline.com/opinion/columnists/undeserved-pr...

The whole concept of participation trophies came out of the “self-esteem” movement, which has mostly panned out to be BS.

Participation trophies are not addressed in your link.

Well this article sure as hell isn't by a researcher.

The quotes from experts say that "too much" and "undeserved" praise is bad.

A participation trophy is generally very minor in terms of praise.

Much more specific expert quotes are needed here.

>Participation trophies are not bullshit.

I have two participation medals from international sporting competitions. I throw them in the trash after I get them.

I've kept the two bronze medals.

Participation trophies are 100% bullshit.

The reward you get is learning that hard work is its own reward.

> The reward you get is learning that hard work is its own reward.

Maybe for some people the internal feeling is good enough, for others, some token (however worthless you might think it is) works.

Why make people feel bad when its so easy to make them feel good?

Maybe because the goal isn't feeling good?

Found the boomer. You're right, the goal is to feel disappointed. Isn't that what your generation was about, "Disappointment builds character" and all that toxic nonsense?

often, that is literally the goal. and that’s ok.

> Why make people feel bad when its so easy to make them feel good?

Isn't the answer to this question point of the thread?

Participation trophies aren't just about tokens. Everyone who runs a race can get a shirt or something to show they were there. This kind of thing has always been around. Participation trophies are for protecting people from knowledge that there were winners and losers in a competition and that they are one of the losers.

I don't know who's getting that message from participation trophies, but I certainly understood winning and losing when I played organized sports as a kid.

When I did sports as a kid I constantly finished close to last. (Just had not one bit of talent and/or genetics)

I was very aware of that fact and nevertheless I went and participated. Mainly because my parents encouraged my personal progress and celebrated small victories and effort.

The particular sport I did also provided small tokens (usually a slightly "fancy" certificate, sometimes a cap or shirt or sth)

Did that help me become good at that particular sport? No not at all.

But the mindset of curiosity and going for your personal best even if others are better did help me later in live.

Preservation goes a long way and encouraging kids to do their best is not a bad thing. Keep it grounded in reality though ("You did good today, great process . Others will make that their career but you showed up and put in the work which is good by itself")

> Participation trophies are for protecting people from knowledge that there were winners and losers in a competition and that they are one of the losers.

Have you ever seen a participation trophy?

I have some from youth sports. They're a tenth the size of the actual placement trophies. They were not an attempt to fool people.

> They were not an attempt to fool people.

That's exactly what they are. The whole reason People started pushing them was to pursue an agenda to affect developmental psychology. Perhaps you are misreading my point, as are others who seem to equate not being a loser with first place. A third place trophy is not fooling anyone that the winner is equal to the first place winner either. Participation trophies allow children to accumulate a room full of trophies and praise from relatives.

If it's very clearly distinguished from placement trophies to everyone involved, then where's the deception?

I see you want to come over to my house next week and paint the walls.

Od course I am not paying anything because hard work is its own reward.

What? No!

I can just watch you paint the walls and get credit for just showing up.

This whole thing got me thinking about my time in Panama. It was a combat zone but we weren’t doing war stuff so didn’t get combat patches even though we qualified because the 82nd doesn’t give out participation trophies. Hell, they were talking about not giving us Combat Infantry Badges for the Gulf War even though we were running ops in Iraq before the ground war started because they all surrendered once it did. Though…I used to call my CIB “my participation trophy” when I was in the reserves years later.

Imagine painting somebody's walls and being given a participation trophy lol.

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