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Comment by rikroots | Hacker News Reader

The key takeaway I got from the article was a word I've not come across before: avocation - an activity that someone engages in as a hobby outside their main occupation. I've known of the concept since before I started work[1], but it never occurred to me that there would be an English word for the concept. Which, as I am supposed to be a poet, is a bit embarrassing.

Talking about poets, it's interesting that there's not many full-time poets in the world; most poets need a paying job (often in academia) to cover the bills. I personally think this is a Good Thing as it helps give them (us) a perspective beyond the poetry scene, and the blank page, which helps ferment more enjoyable poems.

[1] - A couple of weeks after starting my first full-time job I discovered I genuinely detest paid employment. For me, the day job really is just a way to fund the rest of my life where all the fun stuff happens.

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My father (born in 1921 and a WW2 vet) was a machinist, a trade he actually enjoyed. But he lectured me as a child to know the difference between a “vocation” and an “avocation” using those exact words. Perhaps this was something that was taught to his generation in school since a lot of work back then was in the factories. So, he made it a point to be involved in bowling leagues, men’s clubs, church choir, etc. in his free time, just like many of his friends and coworkers. Just watch a couple of episodes of the Flintstones and you will see what life was like 50+ years ago. This whole concept of having a life and serious interests outside of work has been mostly lost—but it needs to come back for our collective sanity. The book “Bowling Alone” written on this topic a few years ago is worth reading.

Of course, while the men were out having an avocation, the mothers stayed home with the kids. Now, some sharing of those duties needs to happen. But it is really important.

That was my takeaway as well. The "hustle-mindset" of turning every interest, passion, and hobby into some sort of side-gig is so pervasive currently that the existence of the word that sums up essentially the opposite mentality surprised me. Happy to have found it.

I think this is a reflection of how financially insecure most individuals in modern society are/feel. I believe that if most people were in a better spot financially, then perhaps this desire to extract money from everything would decline.

Robert Frost's Two Tramps in Mud Time[1] is required reading for all supposed poets lacking in knowledge of avocation.

1- http://holyjoe.org/poetry/frost4.htm

> Talking about poets, it's interesting that there's not many full-time poets in the world; most poets need a paying job (often in academia) to cover the bills

Why don't they release poems like songs? In South Asia, there are poetry concerts and it is a hit with the older generation who were exposed to more poetry before movie songs became mainstream.

I can't answer your question, but it does remind me that I read a really interesting article in Slate about Rod McKuen a couple of weeks ago - https://slate.com/culture/2022/10/rod-mckuen-best-selling-po...

Would that really help? My guess is that most musicians and song writers also need another paying job to cover the bills?

Similar to musicians, some would be able to live off of the royalties. Some more would be live off of touring. Some might be able to sell some merch. Some might get beer money - but overall the ecosystem gets more alive than the current state.

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