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Comment by giantg2 | Hacker News Reader

For number 4, what should one do other than work? Number 6 seems to be their answer, but that's still "work" just not at a salaried job.

For number 6, any details on avoiding taxes? Are they in a different jurisdiction? My experience is that self employment taxes (FICA), and the need for benefits makes it so you cannot earn half as much and still take home more.

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I share your skepticism about the author’s outrageous claims, but I can give details on how self employment has given my family more flexibility with taxes and benefits.

We set up a solo 401k let us max out tax-deductible contributions on the employer side as well as the employee side, which is great for our early retirement plans because we have a much higher limit than if we were contributing to a typical employer’s plan. We are also able to work part-time without forfeiting our ability to participate in the plan, unlike a lot of employers which only offer retirement accounts to full-time employees.

We also realized that at least in our state, the income threshold for qualifying for state-sponsored health care is based on adjusted gross income. Our ability to contribute so much of our income to pre-tax retirement accounts means that we can qualify for health care despite earning significantly more, as long as we’re putting all the extra into the retirement accounts. We have to keep our spending low to be able to save that much, but that’s in line with our FIRE goals anyway.

Just curious, what is the state sponsored healthcare? Where I'm at, I'm only aware of Medicaid and CHIP.

Maybe they meant the offerings via the healthcare marketplace available in U.S. via healtcare.gov?

Ah, thanks!

I meant Medicaid but I'm pretty sure marketplace eligibility is also determined by AGI so the same principle would apply. As long as you can keep your spending under the limit, you can put the rest of your income into tax-deferred accounts and still qualify (until your income is so high that you start running up against the contribution limits).

I'm talking about Medicaid — I don't know how it works in other states but in Pennsylvania, one way to qualify for Medicaid/Medical Assistance is by having a MAGI (modified adjusted gross income) below a certain threshold based on family size.[0] (It might only work this way for people with kids under age 21; I'm not sure.)

My husband pointed out that another option available with a solo 401k that is not often available via employer-sponsored plans is the ability to set up a Roth 401k. My understanding is this would allow for much higher Roth contributions compared to a Roth IRA.

[0] https://www.dhs.pa.gov/Services/Assistance/Pages/MA-General-...

Yeah, looks like there are resource restrictions if you don't have kids under 21.

Also a bit risky depending on your exit strategy and the assest recovery mechanism.

Not going lie either... this is generally the type of behavior that gives these programs a bad name and creates pushes for reforms - using them them to FIRE while maxing out the 401k. Most people are fine with assisting the needy through these types of programs. The support for these programs completely changes when given situations like this. Especially when knowing the over a third of the state budget is used for this program and that my own medical care is more expensive due to provider taxes to help cover it.

If you're self-employed, the income can go into the business and you can pay yourself based on what you actually need, while the rest of the income gets put back into the work/business. Even when taxed, those taxes that aren't individual income are taxed much lower than income taxes, so you can "avoid" paying taxes directly until you actually reach a point of profitability where you want to extract that wealth from the business you've grown (aside from the money you actually need at the time, which would still come out of the company to yourself in the form of payroll).

Not an accountant, so I'm likely not perfectly stating the point.

Yeah, there's distributions and draws. But you still can't make 50% and take home more than before.

I'm pretty sure that applies to something like a non passthrough LLC, but would explicitly not apply to a sole proprietorship, which he is advocating for.

Have goals and people that aren't work related. Pursue your own personal interests instead of focusing on your work or career. He kinda gives it away at the end:

> 36. When you stop having big dreams that’s when you’ve died, despite not being buried yet.

How do those dreamers support themselves?

13. Use money to buy your time back.

I think this is the opposite of what I'm asking. Where does the money come from?

That was the joke. A lot of the comments are with the assumption that basic life needs are met.

Most of them probably have a job. This list advises that one should not have a job as the top priority in life, but it doesn't advise against having one.

Ok. I took it in the context of what to do for money and supporting oneself. There are plenty of other things I'd rather be doing, but I have to make money somehow.

FIRE - https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/financial-independence-...

Yeah, and you have to do something to FIRE. The question is, what is that?

It might help to consider this irony:

* point 4 from the post is "Most people don’t want to go to work. They just don’t know what else to do."

* your question above is "what should one do other than work?"

One interpretation of point 4 from the linked article could be phrased as "Nobody really knows what they would even do with their life without work". What if the points in the article are considered as an aspiration or future state rather than something you manifest immediately _right now_?

You can change your mind in an instant and commit to either generating cash flow from a business or real estate, or more passive income via investments in financial securities like stocks and bonds.

While the mindset change is a prerequisite, action and compounding take time. You can live the ideas behind principles of the points today in an instant, but it may take many years to actually realize the actual state described in the article.

There are many resources that seem to mix in with the career/finance/income points made in the article. For example, in the US-centric book "Set For Life" Scott Trench advances the theory that one should:

* build a $25k buffer/fund * use that safety net to take swings at cashflow opportunities

While I don't really even subscribe to that, there are many, many avenues that have worked for different people. It's probably worth exploring which one appeals the most to you if you'd like that sort of radical change.

Even investing a salary towards FIRE goals is a HUGE mental leap vs. the status quo if taken seriously.

It's not ironic at all. There's plenty of stuff I'd rather do. The question is how does one support themself.

"You can change your mind in an instant and commit to either generating cash flow from a business or real estate, or more passive income via investments in financial securities like stocks and bonds."

Generally requiring significant capital. The question is how does one secure that capital without work.

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