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Comment by robotresearcher | Hacker News Reader

I have never gotten over Microsoft putting ads on the Windows desktop. It felt like the Rubicon was crossed at that moment: no longer would my personal computer be mine. And that was from a software company doing it to software that I paid for.

What should we expect from an advertising company?

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My journey is Windows -> Mac -> Linux. I hope to stick with Linux (or at least OSS operating systems) for the remainder of my career. My computer is mine, and it's never felt more like mine than it does now.

It's not without its bumps and warts, but I highly recommend it.

Also, gaming isn't perfect, but it's really quite good for the kinds of games I play (mostly indie games on Steam).

I went Windows 10 to Linux. Gaming is more than ok, thanks Steam, and for those games that don't run under Linux I have double boot. My whole Windows career I insisted in Pro liscences, the peivate always felt wierd. And aince Windows 11 simply unusable, Win 10 Pro is still accwptable, every time I see a Home version I feel like crying... The last Windows were I really felt like my computer was as mine as it does with Linux was NT and Windows 2000. With the same shenenigans for installong software from third parties like under modern Ubuntu, maybe that plays a role too.

I went from Windows -> Linux -> Windows with a Linux VM. Honestly Linux is just too much of a hassle to get it working right directly on the hardware - I always had issues with either drivers, sound, multiple monitors, etc. And while I'm sure these could be resolved one way or another I just don't have the time (anymore) to troubleshoot my own system every other month. Windows is perfectly fine for web browsing, text editing, gaming etc. - while I can program in a familiar Linux environment. Added bonus: whenever I change computers I can just copy the VM image to the new one and continue instantly.

I went Windows > Mac > Linux > Mac > Linux

Just recently got a System 76 machine and they really nail the whole experience. Last time I tried to do 100% linux desktop was probably around 2016, and while it wasn't bad, gaming was impossible except for a hilariously small number of titles and I still had trouble with drivers for most everyday things, had wifi problems etc. It was not bad, but not really something I could use 100% of the time.

Pop!_OS has been great so far, and most importantly, Linux gaming is now really, really incredible. I don't do much multiplayer gaming these days, but I've played a bunch of new titles including CyberPunk 2077 and Stray, plus nearly my entire back catalog, and they play perfectly without any fiddling to get them started.

Most important:

> My computer is mine, and it's never felt more like mine than it does now.

I hadn't realized how slowly my Mac had become more and more Apple's machine over time. I felt like I was slowly losing control of more and more of the device and more things were also Apple's things (for example files stored on iCloud which is both convenient but also feels like I'm really using Apple's computer).

Linux desktop, and getting back to using mostly OSS again really made me enjoy computing again and realize how much everything else feels like you're working on a big advertising box.

Even Apple has ads in iOS now, and nobody complains about it.

No one?

Let me be the first. I would like to note my formal complaint at apple put ads on my expensive iPhone.

Maybe I’m a nobody, but I’m somebody.

They have ads in the store. Not on iOS in general.

Not if you count the ads to activate Apple products like AppleTv/AppleMusic

You mean the UI to enable the services? Those aren’t ads.

But they are? Under Settings, there is no "Apple Arcade" where I can decide whether to enable it or not. It's on top of all settings, and it pushes me to do it. It's an ad.

This doesn’t make sense. Of course you can decide whether to enable Apple Arcade or not. Obviously it’s a paid service, so you have to pay to enable it.

Who is ‘pushing’ you to do anything?

It's a banner on top of settings that has to be forcefully hidden, it's not in the Apple Arcade setting. Many people are explaining to you that if it behaves like an ad and smells like an ad, it's an ad.

I feel that you are either arguing in bad faith, or determined to defend Apple at all costs. I guess when your car manufacturer will start showing you "Enable Entertaining Package Plus for 14$/mo" in your car dashboard, you will be happy, think "of course I can decide whether to enable it or not", and probably feel very clever.

I question who is arguing in bad faith here.

If you are comparing a panel in the settings app to an ad on the dashboard of a car, I think it’s pretty clearly not me.

I like how you decide to call one "a panel" and the other "an ad" when they are exactly the same thing.

the store is part of the OS, you cannot delete the app store, you cannot use an alternative app store, and you cannot turn the ads off. Ads are part of the OS.

https://support.apple.com/guide/iphone/control-how-apple-del...

Propositionally true but misleading.

Ads are only in the store, not the OS in general.

Your eyes are part of your head, and your head is part of your body.

You have eyes in your head, and not in the rest of your body.

We don’t say you have eyes in your body, even though you can make the logical case for this truth, because it would be misleading in the same way.

you're trying a little too hard. Ads are built into the code that apple ships to every iPhone, and thats that.

Nice goalpost changing. Nobody said it wasn’t bundled into code that ships with the iPhone.

There are ads in the App Store - we agree on that.

Odd take.

Why odd? It’s a growing movement in the real world.

https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2015/aug/11/can-cities-ki...

This is wrong. There are plenty of ads outside of the App Store, like:

- There are adds for iCloud in the Settings app.

- There are ads for Apple News in the Stocks app.

There are no adds for iCloud in the settings app. There is a page where you can pay for the service.

But.. I’ll grant the second - there are ads for Apple News in the stocks app.

So no. There are not “plenty of ads” outside the App Store.

Apple Maps is an Ad when I click on an address and only have google maps installed

You’re having to work hard. A link to renable a standard feature that was included with the OS is not an ad.

If my phone automatically recognizes addresses but refuses to recognize the world’s leading map service and instead sends me to the App Store to use their second rate app, it’s certainly an ad.

Obviously you don’t know the history:

https://appleinsider.com/articles/12/09/26/disagreements-ove...

As for being a second rate app, that was once true, but isn’t now.

https://appleinsider.com/articles/22/05/13/compared-apple-ma...

It seems that you are unaware that Google maps uses location data to make ads follow you around. That seems like a pretty good reason for Apple to protect its users from Google’s data collection machine.

I want google maps to use my position data so that I know where traffic jams are in real time. It has saved me a bunch.

Apple Maps still sends people to strange places when you leave the city. (Apple Maps once sent us to the middle of a farm field, which was funny at the time, so I was glad it happened.)

Apple Maps has traffic jam data. For that matter, my DVD based navigation in my 10 year old car gets real time traffic updates.

Neither of them involve using my position data to let ads track me.

Additionally nothing stops you from using Google Maps on iOS, or Waze for that matter, another Google Mapping product renowned for good traffic data.

In any case it sounds like you would prefer tighter integration of Google products into the OS, and have no problem with them collecting data on you.

In this case why not just use Android?

I'll certainly never use Windows again; for any reason. The idea of built-in advertising within an OS is absolutely a line too far crossed.

Doesn't matter that you can disable it; it's the existence of the advertising alone that tells me enough about the garbage philosophy of the company producing the software that I want nothing to do with it, and I could never rightfully recommend it to anyone.

So you don’t use either iOS or Android? Those both have ads in the OS.

Isn't it mainly plugs for stuff like their web browser or office products? I feel like the only way around that is using some kind of OSS or linux. Apple is always pushing their stuff on me. iCloud, The TV app, the music app, oh sign up for apple health. Plus if you use iOS, you basically need to use their web browser.

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